OT <<<Ping Denny>>>
From : roy
Q: after reading a few of marsh monsters posts i wonder beekeep path sn-us!sn-xit-11!sn-xit-05!sn-xit-07!super.com!feed.2me.com!.glorb.com!feed-3001.bay.webtv.net!sorter-3001.bay.webtv.net!not-for-mail from swampgrass5@webtv.net marsh monster subject re removing transmission...and bleeding the clutch hydraulics date thu 27 oct 2005 192133 -0500 organization webtv subscriber lines 34 message-id 6315-43616f0d-289@storefull-3353.bay.webtv.net references kc38f.10933$cg.5785@02.roc.ny nntp-posting-host localhost.webtv.net mime-version 1.0 webtv content-type text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 content-transfer-encoding quoted-printable x-webtv-signature 1 etatahuagzmr9b5mqydj7y0ygi3wpzm5n3ycff4ujejacvcqw3ortfhe4ozjfwao content-disposition inline .
Replies:
From : mac davis
yes i disagree that air in the system when heated will apply more pressure to the to bearing. as i stated the system is open to the reservoir when the pedal is in the released position therefore any pressure buildup would merely push the fluid back into the reservoir rather than apply more pressure to the to bearing. thats terrific in a perfect world. what happens if the pedal doesnt fully release back pedaling again your claim was and has been that entrapped air alone will cause the to bearing to apply even in an otherwise normal system. a failure of the pedal to release is an abnormal condition. budd is claiming that entrapped air alone caused the to to apply and that a simple bleeding cured the problem. if the pedal wasnt in the full up position and bleeding was used to cure the problem the problem would recur; budd claims it didnt. .
From : jmc
on tue 01 nov 2005 021942 gmt denny wddodge@woh.rr.com wrote on sun 30 oct 2005 132454 -0500 roy roy@home.net wrote on sat 29 oct 2005 171936 -0400 roy roy@home.net wrote just moved the plow out of the garage and now it is snowing. should be a helluva winter!! roy good luck!! im glad youre ready cause im not. 58 degrees around here today and im loving it. denny no way this will be plowable. i still have to come up with some compensatory weight. dont go there.g roy i guess the freight charges to get bugs there would be counter productive right bro you would be correct. the deal with transporting the friggin rabbit is the added expense of the permits and escort vhicles for the wide load. perhaps one of those catapult things you build sorry the name escapes me tr... something. maybe ya could sort of launch him this way. roy i think he would overload a treb bro.. they usually threw 250 pound rocks.. on the good side since the trajectory is at about a 45 degree angle he might gain distance with proper use of the ears as flaps.. mac please remove splinters before emailing yeah and on the way down he can use the cottontail as a drogue chute... ^ mike and how many $$ would all you comedians pay to get pictures of this event im thinking i may be able to retire...... denny hmm... very tempting.... truly one of those id pay to see that events.. might be a long retirement though like forever...would your life insurance pay on something like this remember what goes up at 45 degrees comes down at that angle and at about the same speed..... splat! mac please remove splinters before emailing .
From : roy
yes i disagree that air in the system when heated will apply more pressure to the to bearing. as i stated the system is open to the reservoir when the pedal is in the released position therefore any pressure buildup would merely push the fluid back into the reservoir rather than apply more pressure to the to bearing. thats terrific in a perfect world. what happens if the pedal doesnt fully release then you have a defective clutch master cylinder or pedal linkage and you would have the same expansion problems regardless of any air in the system unless ofcourse you also believe that fluids dont expand when heated. what if the system has a pinhole leak in it somewhere then you would run out of fluid and would have shifting problems long before the to bearing failed unless of course the to was defective to begin with. what if the slave cylinder is leaking air into the system it would be a highly unusual situation for this to happen but even if it did the air introduced into the system would cause clutch disengagement problems long before any possibility of trashing the to but unless we also have a defective master cylinder or pedal linkage there would still be no added pressure from vapor expansion. your assumption is a perfectly operating system under perfect operating conditions. thats great if it happens. perfect no normal yes and if a component in the system is defective then it is the cause of the problem not the air. service manuals caution against overfilling the reservoir for this very reason; an overfull reservoir would result in the phenomenom you describe but overfull is not a normal condition. no one said all things were normal. no one assumed except you and tbone that all things were in perfect operating order. the claim was that the design of the system itself was the cause of the premature bearing failure and was then added that air in the system alone would also cause this and both of these statements are incorrect. no but i do understand the operation of a normally functioning system and in a normally functioning system the phenomenom that you claim occurs is impossible. yet youve just given an example of how a normally functioning system might not be as normally functioning as it should be. then if the system has a defective component then that is the cause of the failure including the to itself no air in the system. the funny thing here is that nobody knows if there actually is any air in the system anyway lol. of course a malfunctioning system can cause any number of problems but the phenomenon that you claim will occur in a system whose only abnormality is air entreapment is total nonsense. perhaps thats why when finding such a situation you check it for further problems. instead of budd saying air could be trapped and apply pressure to the to bearing and you saying nonsense never happen not a possibility you suck as a mechanic you might sit back and ask why such an event would happen and what other possible problems are present. thats why good trouble shooting is essential and why instead of backpedalling and putting conditions on your claims now you admit other problems might help cause exactly what budd is saying that it couldnt possibly happen. if it did happen then the problem is elsewhere not the air that may be trapped in the system and if one of these conditions existed it would happen and probably be worse if there was no air in the system as a expanding fluid puts much much more pressure than a much more compressible expanding gas. yes weird things happen but your chosen happening wont happen. but you admit its possible under certain conditions. you also seem to think its a perfect world and only one problem happens at a time. actually he did not. learn how to read. -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving .
From : jmc
it was a loose nut on top. thanks guys i had the same type of noise after i replaced the shocks and a slight additional tightening of the bolts solved the problem. i had the same sort of clunk you are describing and although my shocks appeared to be tight i put my impact wrench to it and no more clunk. id double check those shocks. it may be another issue but with you having new shocks id suspect that area. -- laszlo almasi carolina watercraft works inc. in the battle between money and love money will always triumph i may have to change my signature......on second thought i was right the first time. i can not seem to find what is clunking in the front end. i have looked and looked. the shifter linkage update has been done. the tie rod ends do move freely. is there any chance they are the problem it sounds like bad sway bar bushings but they are tight. it only does it on bumpy roads. the truck tracks straight and does not pull. it has new shocks that are also tight. the ball joints are ok. the l-h side has a very small amount of movement. i am not really sure how to check the control arm bushings. can they cause a clunking thanks scott .
From : roy
i ran across this blurb in a lance camper brochure. it had a section that talks about the reese titan class v hitch box extensions and the trailer weight capacity based on different lance models. for the smaller campers lance 845 820 and 821 short beds the tow capacity of the hitch extension is 8000/800 trailer weight/hitch weight based on a 21 extension but for all the other larger campers it goes down to 6000/600 based on a 48 extension. those values are with a weight distributing hitch. without deduct 2000/200 or 1500/150 based on model from the above figures. john nathan w. collier wrote nope long box. http//inlinediesel.com/trucks/3gen/1/index.html nice trucks. i still like the srw ones the best just the looks of those duals is wierd to me...........but i know they serve a purpose. i like the srw as well but there are advantages both ways. i like the tire size options i have with the srw and ours is definately easier to park at the mall than our drw. the advantage of the drw comes apparent when youre towing a trailer weighing more than the truck. ive pulled our trailer with both trucks and the drw truck definately controls it better. its not that the srw doesnt control it....it just doesnt control it as good as the drw. .
From : mac davis
not likely if you service a gas engine correctly and add a engine oil cooler like the oil burner has to have it will die without one rubbish there are many diesels that do not have oil lube oil coolers. will last about as long and when it time comes it will be a lot cheaper to fix. wrong again. diesels have a proven record of going farther than a gasoline engine mainly due to a heavier design. everyone that says how great and cheap oil burners are never factor in the cost of buy and maintaining one and now the higher cost of fuel and not to mention the the front of the truck weighs about 700 or 800 pounds more up front with a cummins in it and removes payload capacity because the gvw of a like gas truck is the same. 1 cost of buying one is higher but then so is resale value. 2 maintenance is cheaper as diesels do not require plugs wires coils cap and rotor if still used 3 cost of fuel vs gasoline is not high enough to make diesels less economical to operate. 4 having that 1100# engine sitting on my axle means i dont have a problem steering or going in snow. 5 removal of payload my truck is rated at 8800 gross. the axles and tires are rated at a combined 12000# and ive put 14000# on the road and driven several miles. thats 5200# more than the claimed gvwr. they did not redesigned the frame and front end for that weight either and give it it own front end it is the same frame and front end that is used in a gas truck. and im sure you have proof that the frame under the gasoline powered truck is only good enough for the light gasoline engine ive jumped my truck over a snow mound and put 4 of air under the front wheels. the truck frame is fine trackbar sucked and was replaced. dodge quietly replace the front axle design in 03 because of the problems they were have with front drive axle on ctd models from added weight. quietly bullshit it was announced that they switched to american axle and that happened in 2002 iirc. i run a few plow trucks and have for years and i know that i can start my gas trucks a minus 20 quickly with no heat and be on my way quickly if need be and i can shut it off anytime anywhere in any weathr and know i can restart it and i do not have to leave it banging away wasting fuel to keep it warm. none of what you describe above is true of a cummins powered truck. i can go to a drive thru and not have to shout or turn my engine off to be heard either and nobody knows i am coming until a get there either because it is quiet and nobody knows i am in a truck when on cell phone either. who gives a fuck i mean if you want to sound like you are in an office go stand in an office. the problem isnt as bad as you make it out to be. gas here is 2.13 and diesel is 3.34 if you arent lying it sucks to be you. -- max give a man a match and he is warm for a short while. light him on fire and he is warm for the rest of his life. .
From : budd cochran
you may save tire wear but im betting you will use more fuel. take into account that the tires and rims are heavier than stock with the increased ride height you will have a lot more drag on the road. plus those larger tires will take more fuel to get them moving as well as your ratio change is higher than you have. you will be looking at closer to a 3.00 ratio. lower rpm isnt always a good thing. i have never seen any 22.5 tire that will give a good ride on a light weight vehicle either. hope you know a good dentist. if you have abs your going to have lots of fun getting it to work correctly with that much rubber as well. good luck. -- steve mike good question. the answer is i think so. lets assume i keep the truck for 200k miles i will save 3 sets of tires for $1000 plus say a 10% fuel savings which is 11560 gallons at 17.3 mpg verses 10526 gallons at 19 mpg with the difference being 1000 gal + at say $2.50 a gallon for about $2500. so without the cool factor the better ride the better gearing the lower stress on the motor and chassis potentially yes. but i think the key to the answer is how long will i keep the truck. steve roy that will change my 4.10s into 3.55s or 3.65s. effectively putting 70mph at 1800 rpm which will save a lot of fuel. it will make the ride smoother quieter and increase tire life to more than 200k miles. additionally it will add significantly more life to the truck. we are fortunate to have both the brakes and the suspension to handle the mod. the gm product cannot without extensive suspension changes. unfortuately it also adds 25lbs in unsprung weight at each wheel so the shock absorbers should also be changed to gas type. this change will set me back about $5000 all in though. steve steve will your payback be equal to your outlay obviously the cool factor has to fit in there somewhere though ^ mike i am going to convert my 17 wheels to 22.5 alcoas. this will increase my tire height 6. is it possible to recalibrate the speedometer 15% any help will be appreciated. steve what will that change do to your gearing roy ----== posted via feeds.com - unlimited-uncensored-secure usenet ==---- http//www.feeds.com the #1 group service in the world! 120000+ groups ----= east and west-coast server farms - total privacy via encryption =---- .
From : denny
the reverend natural light wrote i always stop and put the transmission in neutral before switching to 4-low. are you shifting it under power -rev yes i stop put it in neutral switch to 4 low wait until the light shows its synched up put it in drive and give it gas slowly. .
From : mike simmons
if its a daily driver then somethings been neglected like oil and oil filter changes. it appears you have sludge blocked passages. time for some r&r im afraid. -- budd cochran engine is in a daily driver that was running fine. it burned a valve and when i pulled the valve covers i found the oil problem. oil gets changed regularly. it has been running this way for a while because the rockers are badly worn and the heads and lifter gallery are dry. oil comes from the mains up to the rocker shaft stands. then thru the shafts to the rockers. what kind of general shape is the engine in lots of miles with few oil changes has it been sitting for a bunch of years -- budd cochran i have a 1986 dodge 318 that is not getting any oil to the heads. are the pushrods in this engine supposed to have holes in them or does it oil some other way ive only worked on chevys until now. .
From : denny
do you disagree that an improprerly bled system is working improperly do you have proof that an improperly bled system cannot apply more pressure to a in this case static to bearing do you have proof that it can as you both know and are counting on it is impossible to prove a negative but since you seem to be now making the claim that it can happen a positive how about backing it up. both budd and i have seen cases where a hydraulic clutch system has applied the to bearing due to an improperly bled system. ive seen cases where the master cylinder pushed air into the system the slave cylinder sucked air int othe system and where they both leaked. you deny that these systems undergo reality based events by claiming what weve seen cant possibly happen. you made the claim that its impossible back it up. weve both merely suggested that odd things can happen despite what the sytem design may allow or safeguard against. i dont have proof of many things that ive seen because i didnt sit there and say a group of jackasses will ask me about this in the future i better take pics put arrows and circles on them document it have it notorized and hermetically seal it so itll be fresh when i pull it out of the file cabinet. is that what we did wrong not documenting every little fuse replacement we ever did to tom that requires that i ask the question . . .did you document every day you worked as a technician do you know every possible situation problem result solution to a hydraulic system resorting to the law of infinite possibilities now are we i must say max you do make me laugh. resortign to it hell nature does it all the time as do mechanical things. ive seen things happen that i cannot figure out why a certain problem caused it. i just know they are broken so i fix it and the odd event goes away. sadly you seem to not have anywhere near the experience that a bunch of us do so you dont understand how strange some problems are and why those problems cause really odd things to happen. thats sad because you liek to come off like you know all the possible problems symptoms or solutions to any given situation. and like most humans there is no way you could you just dont want to admit it. thats why there are groups like this so that many hundreds of people with differing experiences can share and learn from others. in this case where you think you know all there is to know about hydraulic systems on vehicles i know for sure youve never seen or tried to bleed a set of kelsey-hayes four piston calipers on an a-body mopar. if you had youd know that trapped air sometimes never finds its way out. and yes there is a reason for it. stifled scream no no a thousand times no . . .id rather be crucified splinters under the nails . . . .anything but that . . . . runs off in total panic screaming. but hey feel free to think that there are no problems beyond what the text book and the fsm describe. agreed. personally i always enjoyed sorting out the non-clinical problems as they challenged me to think outside the box. -- max give a man a match and he is warm for a short while. light him on fire and he is warm for the rest of his life. budd .
From : tbone
on sun 30 oct 2005 093917 -0700 nathan w. collier bucketdump@yahoo.com wrote nope long box. http//inlinediesel.com/trucks/3gen/1/index.html nice trucks. i still like the srw ones the best just the looks of those duals is wierd to me...........but i know they serve a purpose. i like the srw as well but there are advantages both ways. i like the tire size options i have with the srw and ours is definately easier to park at the mall than our drw. the advantage of the drw comes apparent when youre towing a trailer weighing more than the truck. ive pulled our trailer with both trucks and the drw truck definately controls it better. its not that the srw doesnt control it....it just doesnt control it as good as the drw. nate.. just one of those logical things that usually dont meet with reality but ive always figured that the best use for a drw was for things like a slide-in where you have more of a tendency to sway from being kinda top heavy.. we saw a nice rig on a recent trip... 3/4 ton ford with a huge slide in that raised and lowered like a popup.. cab height when on the road... the guy said that he drove offroad a lot and between high center of gravity and cross winds he got rid of his old slide-in and got the popup one... he was pulling a 20 fishing boat with an atv rack on the trailer..lol mac please remove splinters before emailing .
From : denny
professional mechanic or not if you cant communicate youre perceived as an idiot. so thats what happened to me.... ive been pondering that for years.. denny .
From : roy
suddenly without warning denny exclaimed 28-oct-05 137 am suddenly without warning mac davis exclaimed 27-oct-05 408 pm on wed 26 oct 2005 215332 +0100 jmc nogroupsspam@nojodibody.homeus wrote id like to say the op has been sitting back quite enjoying this little exchange one of these days im going to have to do some googling to find out the origin of the whole bunny thing though jmc who has been getting pretty thoroughly rained on for the last week. perhaps i should have installed pontoons rather than new tires... he could tell you but then hed have to kill you.. ah but hed have to catch me first and i have a biiig head start! - jmc but your gonna come home sooner or later... i think the old saying is time is on my side. bg denny perhaps. you may have to wait a bit though. at the moment were considering getting even further away. and much much drier. besides my dak goes much faster than you can hop! jmc i know dakotas and you dont know how fast i hop......plus i got the edge in experience. hop you gotta be kidding!!!! it is more of a quick waddle at this stage. waddle hell! hes damned near to the roll stage! ^ mike waddle roll im speechless........ that would be a first. roy denny .
From : jmc
john this isnt rocket science. adding five inches to tire height with a lift kit using your original wheels additional unsprung weight with no other changes puts safety in question. the lift kit puts your bounce and jounce ratio out of center which will cause severe toe change on bump encounters. the angle of incidence which is the imaginary line through the center of your king pins/balljoints should intersect the center of the tires contact patch on the road to effect neutral loading of the steering arms during bounce/jounce braking and acceleration. by adding the extra tire height you have shifted the contact patch inboard and now the intersect point of the angle of incidence is outboard which creates severe compression and expansion loading of the tie rod the tie rod ends and pitman arm. this is a very unsafe situation. i would do 2 things immediately. i would add 1/4 spacers to the wheels and use gas filled heavy duty shocks. this is a band-aid not a total fix but it should keep you from killing yourself or someone else. steve getting severe shimmy on my 04 2500 on the freeway going over 70 mph when hitting a bump in the road. wondering if anyone else is having this problem. i have a rancho leveling kit with 35 in. tires. knowone seems to be able to fix the problem rancho has there tecks looking into the problem. chrysler says no problems. any imput thanks jd .
From : mike simmons
getting severe shimmy on my 04 2500 on the freeway going over 70 mph when hitting a bump in the road. wondering if anyone else is having this problem. i have a rancho leveling kit with 35 in. tires. knowone seems to be able to fix the problem rancho has there tecks looking into the problem. chrysler says no problems. any imput thanks jd .
From : mac davis
on sun 30 oct 2005 215735 -0500 ljb notnub@sympatico.ca wrote thank you tom and everyone else for your input on these two issues i am a little wiser. suprised there were no comments about the beer. now if someone could help me understand women a little better... or where their manual is hidden... thx ljb ill take a shot at that one... being married 3 times you have to learn something.. it gets down to their basic philosophy women are from venus and dont give a shit where men are from as long as they stay there.. or at least go back on monday morning.. mac please remove splinters before emailing .