OT: 97 jeep running real rich, dies, gas in oil
From : jacob suter
Q: friend of mine is broke and ive offered yeah yeah im a sucker to help him fix his transportation - a 97 jeep wrangler 2.2l/5 speed. it has about 80k miles and recently had been down for a few months due to a spontanious transmission failure... essentially heres the conditions #1 - runs like shit an gets horrible fuel economy #2 - visable black no white or grey smoke from tailpipe at lower rpms/idle #3 - idles badly likes to die #4 - getting gas in oil.. personally this sounds exactly like when the fuel pressure regulator started leaking on my old exploder but weve come to realize its built like my 99 dodge and has no engine mounted vacuum adjusting fpr... my only ideas are either bad injectors computer gone haywire or sensor feeding it some bs or a bad in-tank fuel pressure regulator pushing the fuel rail pressure up. it is throwing a check engine light and that computer will dump out codes but i forgot to ask if he had checked them yet... any ideas thanks jacob suter .
Replies:
From : jeepnutz
lo sorry but im still sensitive to sparkplug shocks after over 40 years. i used to test small engine coils with a c cell battery and let the spark lead rest on my arm. when you break the primary circuit a small but definite shock results but it shows the coil could still work at lower than normal voltages. i didnt mean to make it sound like the expirienced mechanic is immune to the shock but theyre more likely to use a pair of insulated pliers to pull the wire instead of grabbing it with their hand and changing their name to circut... lol i thought it was ground. vbg sorry for the misunderstanding. btw i have met a few mechanics back when i and the universe were young that could grab plug wire and tell if the spark was good or not. immune no but tolerant for sure. budd .
From : denny
maybe im pointing out that correct suggestion may be of more help that wild ass guesses. ya never know denny... it could be a loose gas cap groan vbg denny .
From : budd cochran
on 07 sep 2004 061222 gmt mopar440@aol.comnet.org redneck tookover hell wrote recommend it... i dont know if the new dakotas have a higher tow max than they did in 01 but i doubt it.. in 01 the dak with 4.7l auto and 3.55 gears had a max of 5150 lbs if you had a 410 rear end it was 6450... i heard on some automotive show today the 2005 dakota 4 door crewcab/quadcab whatever is supposed to be available with either the regular 230/390 4.7 or a ho 250/400 4.7 with either a 6 speed manual or 5 speed auto. they are supposed to be almost 4 inches longer than current with a 131 inch wheelbase no information given on towing capacity well from a towing aspect the part that helps the most is the longer wheelbase.. mac .
From : budd cochran
could an injector or more be stuck open that would make it run like an over rich carb i think. budd friend of mine is broke and ive offered yeah yeah im a sucker to help him fix his transportation - a 97 jeep wrangler 2.2l/5 speed. it has about 80k miles and recently had been down for a few months due to a spontanious transmission failure... essentially heres the conditions #1 - runs like shit an gets horrible fuel economy #2 - visable black no white or grey smoke from tailpipe at lower rpms/idle #3 - idles badly likes to die #4 - getting gas in oil.. personally this sounds exactly like when the fuel pressure regulator started leaking on my old exploder but weve come to realize its built like my 99 dodge and has no engine mounted vacuum adjusting fpr... my only ideas are either bad injectors computer gone haywire or sensor feeding it some bs or a bad in-tank fuel pressure regulator pushing the fuel rail pressure up. it is throwing a check engine light and that computer will dump out codes but i forgot to ask if he had checked them yet... any ideas thanks jacob suter .
From : tbone
friend of mine is broke and ive offered yeah yeah im a sucker to help him fix his transportation - a 97 jeep wrangler 2.2l/5 speed. it has about 80k miles and recently had been down for a few months due to a spontanious transmission failure... essentially heres the conditions #1 - runs like shit an gets horrible fuel economy #2 - visable black no white or grey smoke from tailpipe at lower rpms/idle #3 - idles badly likes to die #4 - getting gas in oil.. personally this sounds exactly like when the fuel pressure regulator started leaking on my old exploder but weve come to realize its built like my 99 dodge and has no engine mounted vacuum adjusting fpr... my only ideas are either bad injectors computer gone haywire or sensor feeding it some bs or a bad in-tank fuel pressure regulator pushing the fuel rail pressure up. it is throwing a check engine light and that computer will dump out codes but i forgot to ask if he had checked them yet... any ideas you need to beg borrow or steal a fuel pressure guage to test this properly. it might be a good idea to gt those codes as well. i would lean more towards a hung or damaged injectors than a bad regulator although it is possible that a bad regulator damaged the injectors. a volt meter may also come in handy to make sure that none of the injectors are being held open electrically. thanks jacob suter .
From : denny
friend of mine is broke and ive offered yeah yeah im a sucker to help him fix his transportation - a 97 jeep wrangler 2.2l/5 speed. it has about 80k miles and recently had been down for a few months due to a spontanious transmission failure... essentially heres the conditions #1 - runs like shit an gets horrible fuel economy #2 - visable black no white or grey smoke from tailpipe at lower rpms/idle #3 - idles badly likes to die #4 - getting gas in oil.. personally this sounds exactly like when the fuel pressure regulator started leaking on my old exploder but weve come to realize its built like my 99 dodge and has no engine mounted vacuum adjusting fpr... my only ideas are either bad injectors computer gone haywire or sensor feeding it some bs or a bad in-tank fuel pressure regulator pushing the fuel rail pressure up. it is throwing a check engine light and that computer will dump out codes but i forgot to ask if he had checked them yet... any ideas you need to beg borrow or steal a fuel pressure guage to test this properly. it might be a good idea to gt those codes as well. i would lean more towards a hung or damaged injectors than a bad regulator although it is possible that a bad regulator damaged the injectors. a volt meter may also come in handy to make sure that none of the injectors are being held open electrically. tom i tried sitting on my fingers but its not working. you havent done any real-world drivability problems have you. you read this stuff and then think up possibilities while slurping down a cup of coffee sitting at a tabledont ya... denny .
From : tbone
friend of mine is broke and ive offered yeah yeah im a sucker to help him fix his transportation - a 97 jeep wrangler 2.2l/5 speed. it has about 80k miles and recently had been down for a few months due to a spontanious transmission failure... essentially heres the conditions #1 - runs like shit an gets horrible fuel economy #2 - visable black no white or grey smoke from tailpipe at lower rpms/idle #3 - idles badly likes to die #4 - getting gas in oil.. personally this sounds exactly like when the fuel pressure regulator started leaking on my old exploder but weve come to realize its built like my 99 dodge and has no engine mounted vacuum adjusting fpr... my only ideas are either bad injectors computer gone haywire or sensor feeding it some bs or a bad in-tank fuel pressure regulator pushing the fuel rail pressure up. it is throwing a check engine light and that computer will dump out codes but i forgot to ask if he had checked them yet... any ideas you need to beg borrow or steal a fuel pressure guage to test this properly. it might be a good idea to gt those codes as well. i would lean more towards a hung or damaged injectors than a bad regulator although it is possible that a bad regulator damaged the injectors. a volt meter may also come in handy to make sure that none of the injectors are being held open electrically. tom i tried sitting on my fingers but its not working. you havent done any real-world drivability problems have you. you read this stuff and then think up possibilities while slurping down a cup of coffee sitting at a tabledont ya... denny do you have any valid input no then stfu. with a fuel pressure gauge he can test for both a bad fuel regulator and / or a hung injector. as soon as he turns the ignition on with the gauge connected to the rail he will know if the pump is over or under pressurizing the system. if the gauge drops right back to zero when he turns the ignition off then he either has a defective injector or check valve. if it was also under pressurized it is a clear indication of a leak in the injectors when combined with his other symptoms. with the ignition on and the car not running with a meter he can check for both voltage and ground at each injector and depending on the way they are switched he had better be missing one of them at each one or he has a problem with the computer or harness. this is not rocket science here and it could be something completely different like the tps but the amount of fuel being dumped into the engine indicates some type of fuel delivery failure. btw i have a fuel injected nissan that i have owned and worked on for almost 12 years as well as the ram. how many fuel injected vehicles do you work on -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving .
From : transurgeon
----- original message ----- from jacob suter j4k3@ezho.org sent thursday september 02 2004 1252 am subject ot 97 jeep running real rich dies gas in oil friend of mine is broke and ive offered yeah yeah im a sucker to help him fix his transportation - a 97 jeep wrangler 2.2l/5 speed. it has about 80k miles and recently had been down for a few months due to a spontanious transmission failure... essentially heres the conditions #1 - runs like shit an gets horrible fuel economy #2 - visable black no white or grey smoke from tailpipe at lower rpms/idle #3 - idles badly likes to die #4 - getting gas in oil.. personally this sounds exactly like when the fuel pressure regulator started leaking on my old exploder but weve come to realize its built like my 99 dodge and has no engine mounted vacuum adjusting fpr... my only ideas are either bad injectors computer gone haywire or sensor feeding it some bs or a bad in-tank fuel pressure regulator pushing the fuel rail pressure up. it is throwing a check engine light and that computer will dump out codes but i forgot to ask if he had checked them yet... any ideas thanks jacob suter ruptured diaphagm in the fuel pressure regulator there will be a ose going from fpr to intake pull it off and if you see liquid fuel thats it .
From : denny
do you have any valid input not without guessing. he answered his own question when he thought he should check for codes. no then stfu. look who is giving advise he should be listening to. with a fuel pressure gauge he can test for both a bad fuel regulator and / or a hung injector. as soon as he turns the ignition on with the gauge connected to the rail he will know if the pump is over or under pressurizing the system. if the gauge drops right back to zero when he turns the ignition off then he either has a defective injector or check valve. if it was also under pressurized it is a clear indication of a leak in the injectors when combined with his other symptoms. not really clear. how about a pump that is not putting out with the ignition on and the car not running with a meter he can check for both voltage and ground at each injector and depending on the way they are switched he had better be missing one of them at each one or he has a problem with the computer or harness. this is not rocket science here and it could be something completely different like the tps but the amount of fuel being dumped into the engine indicates some type of fuel delivery failure. btw i have a fuel injected nissan that i have owned and worked on for almost 12 years as well as the ram. it sounds like you have read a book somewhere. to bad all your diagnosing doesnt really describe jacobs problem. a single injector will act more like a dead miss in the real world. not alot of chance that all would go bad at the same time. how many fuel injected vehicles do you work on ok you have worked on two. i do it for a living every day. thank you. denny .
From : transurgeon
friend of mine is broke and ive offered yeah yeah im a sucker to help him fix his transportation - a 97 jeep wrangler 2.2l/5 speed. it has about 80k miles and recently had been down for a few months due to a spontanious transmission failure... essentially heres the conditions #1 - runs like shit an gets horrible fuel economy #2 - visable black no white or grey smoke from tailpipe at lower rpms/idle #3 - idles badly likes to die #4 - getting gas in oil.. personally this sounds exactly like when the fuel pressure regulator started leaking on my old exploder but weve come to realize its built like my 99 dodge and has no engine mounted vacuum adjusting fpr... my only ideas are either bad injectors computer gone haywire or sensor feeding it some bs or a bad in-tank fuel pressure regulator pushing the fuel rail pressure up. it is throwing a check engine light and that computer will dump out codes but i forgot to ask if he had checked them yet... any ideas you need to beg borrow or steal a fuel pressure guage to test this properly. it might be a good idea to gt those codes as well. i would lean more towards a hung or damaged injectors than a bad regulator although it is possible that a bad regulator damaged the injectors. a volt meter may also come in handy to make sure that none of the injectors are being held open electrically. tom i tried sitting on my fingers but its not working. you havent done any real-world drivability problems have you. you read this stuff and then think up possibilities while slurping down a cup of coffee sitting at a tabledont ya... if tom had a fucking clue he would suggest pulling the hose from fpr to intake and looking for liquid fuel............... denny .
From : roy
do you have any valid input not without guessing. he answered his own question when he thought he should check for codes. no then stfu. look who is giving advise he should be listening to. with a fuel pressure gauge he can test for both a bad fuel regulator and / or a hung injector. as soon as he turns the ignition on with the gauge connected to the rail he will know if the pump is over or under pressurizing the system. if the gauge drops right back to zero when he turns the ignition off then he either has a defective injector or check valve. if it was also under pressurized it is a clear indication of a leak in the injectors when combined with his other symptoms. not really clear. how about a pump that is not putting out with the ignition on and the car not running with a meter he can check for both voltage and ground at each injector and depending on the way they are switched he had better be missing one of them at each one or he has a problem with the computer or harness. this is not rocket science here and it could be something completely different like the tps but the amount of fuel being dumped into the engine indicates some type of fuel delivery failure. btw i have a fuel injected nissan that i have owned and worked on for almost 12 years as well as the ram. it sounds like you have read a book somewhere. to bad all your diagnosing doesnt really describe jacobs problem. a single injector will act more like a dead miss in the real world. not alot of chance that all would go bad at the same time. how many fuel injected vehicles do you work on ok you have worked on two. i do it for a living every day. thank you. that would be game set and match. the noise we should be hearing is tom stfu.gbmfg roy .
From : tbone
lol. yea like your unplugging the non existing vacuum line to look for gas was any better. at least what i said would diagnose a failed regulator or leaking injector. yours would do neither since that vehicle doesnt use that type of regulator. care to try again -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving yes he did. he supported the point that i made to denny and tom l. about how this childish infighting and attacks which are usually started by you and shade tree are causing people to go elsewhere to both get and give information. kinda like your sure-fire handy-dandy rootin-tootin cant-miss method of troubleshooting the injectors eh .
From : tbone
do you have any valid input not without guessing. he answered his own question when he thought he should check for codes. no then stfu. look who is giving advise he should be listening to. with a fuel pressure gauge he can test for both a bad fuel regulator and / or a hung injector. as soon as he turns the ignition on with the gauge connected to the rail he will know if the pump is over or under pressurizing the system. if the gauge drops right back to zero when he turns the ignition off then he either has a defective injector or check valve. if it was also under pressurized it is a clear indication of a leak in the injectors when combined with his other symptoms. not really clear. how about a pump that is not putting out with the ignition on and the car not running with a meter he can check for both voltage and ground at each injector and depending on the way they are switched he had better be missing one of them at each one or he has a problem with the computer or harness. this is not rocket science here and it could be something completely different like the tps but the amount of fuel being dumped into the engine indicates some type of fuel delivery failure. btw i have a fuel injected nissan that i have owned and worked on for almost 12 years as well as the ram. it sounds like you have read a book somewhere. to bad all your diagnosing doesnt really describe jacobs problem. a single injector will act more like a dead miss in the real world. not alot of chance that all would go bad at the same time. how many fuel injected vehicles do you work on ok you have worked on two. i do it for a living every day. thank you. that would be game set and match. the noise we should be hearing is tom stfu.gbmfg gee could it be attitudes and attacks like this not yours that has pretty much killed this group and turned everything into a babyassed pissing match ya think! -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving .
From : tom lawrence
gee could it be attitudes and attacks like this not yours that has pretty much killed this group and turned everything into a babyassed pissing match ya think! well seeing as you tend to show up in every long drawn-out pissing match of a thread - i think there could possibly be another cause to the symptom you describe. .
From : denny
do you have any valid input not without guessing. he answered his own question when he thought he should check for codes. no then stfu. look who is giving advise he should be listening to. with a fuel pressure gauge he can test for both a bad fuel regulator and / or a hung injector. as soon as he turns the ignition on with the gauge connected to the rail he will know if the pump is over or under pressurizing the system. if the gauge drops right back to zero when he turns the ignition off then he either has a defective injector or check valve. if it was also under pressurized it is a clear indication of a leak in the injectors when combined with his other symptoms. not really clear. how about a pump that is not putting out with the ignition on and the car not running with a meter he can check for both voltage and ground at each injector and depending on the way they are switched he had better be missing one of them at each one or he has a problem with the computer or harness. this is not rocket science here i re-read this again. you are correct it is not rocket science. with the ign on and engine not running your conditions you can check all day for your voltage at the injectors and there will be none. the pcm has to have a crank signal from the dist to energize the asd to put voltage to the pump tps injectors and something else that im not recalling at this time. your rocket just crashed. sorry denny .
From : budd cochran
doing what to them funny how you didnt blast budd when he essentially said the same thing with a single hung injector. i guess its that selective thing of yours again. rotflmbo!!! ya couldnt even misquote me correctly. i said could an injector or more be stuck open. that would mean one or more injectors stuck open. talk about being selective tom. you have everyone beat at it. budd .
From : tbone
do you have any valid input not without guessing. he answered his own question when he thought he should check for codes. perhaps you missed the part where he asked for suggestions. no then stfu. look who is giving advise he should be listening to. thats right its advice and ideas nothing more. with a fuel pressure gauge he can test for both a bad fuel regulator and / or a hung injector. as soon as he turns the ignition on with the gauge connected to the rail he will know if the pump is over or under pressurizing the system. if the gauge drops right back to zero when he turns the ignition off then he either has a defective injector or check valve. if it was also under pressurized it is a clear indication of a leak in the injectors when combined with his other symptoms. not really clear. how about a pump that is not putting out the fuel pressure gauge would indicate that with an under pressure reading wouldnt it either way since the regulator and pump are combined if either were the problem he would still need to remove them as an assembly and replace them as such. btw are you saying that low pressure would cause these symptoms and if so please explain. with the ignition on and the car not running with a meter he can check for both voltage and ground at each injector and depending on the way they are switched he had better be missing one of them at each one or he has a problem with the computer or harness. this is not rocket science here and it could be something completely different like the tps but the amount of fuel being dumped into the engine indicates some type of fueldelivery failure. btw i have a fuel injected nissan that i have owned and worked on for almost 12 years as well as the ram. it sounds like you have read a book somewhere. i read lots of books and work on vehicles as well but ill take that as a compliment just the same. to bad all your diagnosing doesnt really describe jacobs problem. a single injector will act more like a dead miss in the real world. not alot of chance that all would go bad at the same time. all that he said was that it was running like shit and blowing smoke. he was not specific about whether it was missing or not. he did say it wanted to stall at idle so that could be a miss or maybe not. as for them all going bad at the same time it could happen if the filter failed since it and the regulator are in the same housing and fouled them all. how many fuel injected vehicles do you work on ok you have worked on two. i do it for a living every day. thank you. doing what to them funny how you didnt blast budd when he essentially said the same thing with a single hung injector. i guess its that selective thing of yours again. -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving .
From : tbone
do you have any valid input not without guessing. he answered his own question when he thought he should check for codes. no then stfu. look who is giving advise he should be listening to. with a fuel pressure gauge he can test for both a bad fuel regulator and / or a hung injector. as soon as he turns the ignition on with the gauge connected to the rail he will know if the pump is over or under pressurizing the system. if the gauge drops right back to zero when he turns the ignition off then he either has a defective injector or check valve. if it was also under pressurized it is a clear indication of a leak in the injectors when combined with his other symptoms. not really clear. how about a pump that is not putting out with the ignition on and the car not running with a meter he can check for both voltage and ground at each injector and depending on the way they are switched he had better be missing one of them at each one or he has a problem with the computer or harness. this is not rocket science here i re-read this again. you are correct it is not rocket science. with the ign on and engine not running your conditions you can check all day for your voltage at the injectors and there will be none. the pcm has to have a crank signal from the dist to energize the asd to put voltage to the pump tps injectors and something else that im not recalling at this time. your rocket just crashed. sorry thats exactly what i meant denny. why dont you take the time to read it and pay attention instead of your desperate need to say im wrong. i said to check to make sure an injector is not electrically held open to check them all for voltage and ground with the ignition on and the engine not running and depending on the way they are switched one had better be missing at each one or he has a problem with the computer or harness. was this clear enough for you now -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving .
From : tbone
even if it were completely my fault if i was the only one it couldnt happen now could it. -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving gee could it be attitudes and attacks like this not yours that has pretty much killed this group and turned everything into a babyassed pissing match ya think! well seeing as you tend to show up in every long drawn-out pissing match of a thread - i think there could possibly be another cause to the symptom you describe. .
From : tom lawrence
maybe im pointing out that correct suggestion may be of more help that wild ass guesses. ya never know denny... it could be a loose gas cap .
From : tom lawrence
running and depending on the way they are switched one had better be missing at each one or he has a problem with the computer or harness. was this clear enough for you now okay... real slow this time... with the engine not running or more precisely with the crank sensor not providing a signal the asd relay remains open which doesnt provide any power to the + side of the injectors. so... no crank no voltage. since the injectors are always fed with voltage when the asd relay switches the pcm switches the ground to each injector in sequence when it wants to inject fuel. this means that the - side of the injectors are normally open to ground until switched by the ecm. again no crank no ground switch no reading. now - given that... can you explain how you would test for a bad injector with the engine not running using a simple multi-meter could this be why most professionals will use a noid light set to properly test fuel injectors rather than hacking up a wiring harness for no good reason whatsoever .
From : budd cochran
my battery went dead this morning. must be president bushs fault. yesterday my basement flooded from the storm. i am sure thats his fault because he should certainly control the weather. .
From : denny
do you have any valid input not without guessing. he answered his own question when he thought he should check for codes. perhaps you missed the part where he asked for suggestions. maybe im pointing out that correct suggestion may be of more help that wild ass guesses. no then stfu. look who is giving advise he should be listening to. thats right its advice and ideas nothing more. with a fuel pressure gauge he can test for both a bad fuel regulator and / or a hung injector. as soon as he turns the ignition on with the gauge connected to the rail he will know if the pump is over or under pressurizing the system. if the gauge drops right back to zero when he turns the ignition off then he either has a defective injector or check valve. if it was also under pressurized it is a clear indication of a leak in the injectors when combined with his other symptoms. not really clear. how about a pump that is not putting out the fuel pressure gauge would indicate that with an under pressure reading wouldnt it that is correct. but it not mean it would be a leaky injector. low pressure could mean a pump regulator plugged filter restricted/kinked fuel line or injector. if an injector was leaking that bad you should be able to see it on the plug. either way since the regulator and pump are combined if either were the problem he would still need to remove them as an assembly and replace them as such. on this particulat vehical the pump and filter assembly is separate from the pump. the p/f assembly is located on top of the fuel tank and the pump is a separate piece inside the tank. btw are you saying that low pressure would cause these symptoms and if so please explain. nope that is not what i was saying. jacob was describing a rich condition which could be caused by a number of things. this is why it is important to pull any codes before guessing. possible problems in no particular order could be an oxygen sensor map sensor too high fuel pressure vacuum leak at the intakeor maybe even a restricted exhaust. with the ignition on and the car not running with a meter he can check for both voltage and ground at each injector and depending on the way they are switched he had better be missing one of them at each one or he has a problem with the computer or harness. this is not rocket science here and it could be something completely different like the tps but the amount of fuel being dumped into the engine indicates some type of fuel delivery failure. btw i have a fuel injected nissan that i have owned and worked on for almost 12 years as well as the ram. it sounds like you have read a book somewhere. i read lots of books and work on vehicles as well but ill take that as a compliment just the same. no problem. not a thing wrong with reading and learning. to bad all your diagnosing doesnt really describe jacobs problem. a single injector will act more like a dead miss in the real world. not alot of chance that all would go bad at the same time. all that he said was that it was running like shit and blowing smoke. he was not specific about whether it was missing or not. he did say it wanted to stall at idle so that could be a miss or maybe not. as for them all going bad at the same time it could happen if the filter failed since it and the regulator are in the same housing and fouled them all. its a remote possibility but still a possibility at that. there are other things to look at first that are more likely to be the problem than an injector. how many fuel injected vehicles do you work on ok you have worked on two. i do it for a living every day. thank you. doing what to them fixing them. i guess youll just have to take my word that ive made my living for the last 31 years fixing equipment that other people have broken. i work on what is on the order other than auto trans. those i havent been into for 14 years. funny how you didnt blast budd when he essentially said the same thing with a single hung injector. i guess its that selective thing of yours again. shifting the fault to someone else lets try to keep this civil and maybe fix jacobs problem if we can. i dont read every last post on the group. maybe i missed that one i dont know but im not going to go looking for it either. i do know of budds knowledge with small engines and he does know how to get some serious power out of them. i give him credit for being a good common sense mechanic. denny .
From : denny
tom talking to you is like talking to a female teenager when shes on the rag. you win. denny as usual you dont bother to read before responding. sometimes you are worse than budd. i asked for the vacuum controlled regulator that he claims all fuel injected engines have. -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving really moron please tell me exactly where it is placed on my 97 ram. -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving tom a combination fuel filter and fuel pressure regulator is pressed into a rubber grommet located on the top of the fuel pump module inside the fuel tank. is that exact enough do i need to describe where the fuel tank is located also denny .
From : transurgeon
do you have any valid input not without guessing. he answered his own question when he thought he should check for codes. no then stfu. look who is giving advise he should be listening to. with a fuel pressure gauge he can test for both a bad fuel regulator and / or a hung injector. as soon as he turns the ignition on with the gauge connected to the rail he will know if the pump is over or under pressurizing the system. if the gauge drops right back to zero when he turns the ignition off then he either has a defective injector or check valve. if it was also under pressurized it is a clear indication of a leak in the injectors when combined with his other symptoms. not really clear. how about a pump that is not putting out with the ignition on and the car not running with a meter he can check for both voltage and ground at each injector and depending on the way they are switched he had better be missing one of them at each one or he has a problem with the computer or harness. this is not rocket science here i re-read this again. you are correct it is not rocket science. with the ign on and engine not running your conditions you can check all day for your voltage at the injectors and there will be none. the pcm has to have a crank signal from the dist to energize the asd to put voltage to the pump tps injectors and something else that im not recalling at this time. your rocket just crashed. sorry thats exactly what i meant denny. why dont you take the time to read it and pay attention instead of your desperate need to say im wrong. i said to check to make sure an injector is not electrically held open to check them all for voltage and ground with the ignition on and the engine not running and depending on the way they are switched one had better be missing at each one or he has a problem with the computer or harness. was this clear enough for you now what is clear crystal is that you have no fucking idea when the injectors are triggered there is no voltage to the injector harness none zip nada nyet untill ignition pulses cause the ecm to activate the asd auto-shut-down relay. this relay then provides voltage to the hot side of the injectors and the ecm provides a ground to trigger them. .
From : transurgeon
perhaps you didnt see the part where he said it doesnt have one!!!!! oh it has one spin-boi...............every fi system has one -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving friend of mine is broke and ive offered yeah yeah im a sucker to help him fix his transportation - a 97 jeep wrangler 2.2l/5 speed. it has about 80k miles and recently had been down for a few months due to a spontanious transmission failure... essentially heres the conditions #1 - runs like shit an gets horrible fuel economy #2 - visable black no white or grey smoke from tailpipe at lower rpms/idle #3 - idles badly likes to die #4 - getting gas in oil.. personally this sounds exactly like when the fuel pressure regulator started leaking on my old exploder but weve come to realize its built like my 99 dodge and has no engine mounted vacuum adjusting fpr... my only ideas are either bad injectors computer gone haywire or sensor feeding it some bs or a bad in-tank fuel pressure regulator pushing the fuel rail pressure up. it is throwing a check engine light and that computer will dump out codes but i forgot to ask if he had checked them yet... any ideas you need to beg borrow or steal a fuel pressure guage to test this properly. it might be a good idea to gt those codes as well. i would lean more towards a hung or damaged injectors than a bad regulator although it is possible that a bad regulator damaged the injectors. a volt meter may also come in handy to make sure that none of the injectors are being held open electrically. tom i tried sitting on my fingers but its not working. you havent done any real-world drivability problems have you. you read this stuff and then think up possibilities while slurping down a cup of coffee sitting at a tabledont ya... if tom had a fucking clue he would suggest pulling the hose from fpr to intake and looking for liquid fuel............... denny .
From : jacob suter
on sun 05 sep 2004 214655 gmt theguy theguy@myplace.com wrote on sun 5 sep 2004 113241 -1000 dave --@--.com wrote http//www.catsprn.com/letterofapology.htm dave watching the video footage of 911 these past few days has reminded me of the depth of emotions that i felt that day and the months afterward. the celebrations of next week will hopefully cause more citizens of the world and lazy americans to reflect upon what happened. people some on this ng need to realize that this war isnt for oil it isnt against arabs or muslims. it is a war against terrorism. i hope that we offer our support in any way that we can to the russians to help end terrorism there too. what happened there last week is no different than what happened here on 911. it is simply wrong and it is time to stand against it. im reminded about terror on this date. married for 24 years today! beekeep .
From : tbone
really moron please tell me exactly where it is placed on my 97 ram. -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving perhaps you didnt see the part where he said it doesnt have one!!!!! oh it has one spin-boi...............every fi system has one -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving friend of mine is broke and ive offered yeah yeah im a sucker to help him fix his transportation - a 97 jeep wrangler 2.2l/5 speed. it has about 80k miles and recently had been down for a few months due to a spontanious transmission failure... essentially heres the conditions #1 - runs like shit an gets horrible fuel economy #2 - visable black no white or grey smoke from tailpipe at lower rpms/idle #3 - idles badly likes to die #4 - getting gas in oil.. personally this sounds exactly like when the fuel pressure regulator started leaking on my old exploder but weve come to realize its built like my 99 dodge and has no engine mounted vacuum adjusting fpr... my only ideas are either bad injectors computer gone haywire or sensor feeding it some bs or a bad in-tank fuel pressure regulator pushing the fuel rail pressure up. it is throwing a check engine light and that computer will dump out codes but i forgot to ask if he had checked them yet... any ideas you need to beg borrow or steal a fuel pressure guage to test this properly. it might be a good idea to gt those codes as well. i would lean more towards a hung or damaged injectors than a bad regulator although it is possible that a bad regulator damaged the injectors. a volt meter may also come in handy to make sure that none of the injectors are being held open electrically. tom i tried sitting on my fingers but its not working. you havent done any real-world drivability problems have you. you read this stuff and then think up possibilities while slurping down a cup of coffee sitting at a tabledont ya... if tom had a fucking clue he would suggest pulling the hose from fpr to intake and looking for liquid fuel............... denny .
From : transurgeon
okay... real slow this time... with the engine not running or more precisely with the crank sensor not providing a signal the asd relay remains open which doesnt provide any power to the + side of the injectors. so... no crank no voltage. since the injectors are always fed with voltage when the asd relay switches the pcm switches the ground to each injector in sequence when it wants to inject fuel. this means that the - side of the injectors are normally open to ground until switched by the ecm. again no crank no ground switch no reading. now - given that... can you explain how you would test for a bad injector with the engine not running using a simple multi-meter could this be why most professionals will use a noid light set to properly test fuel injectors rather than hacking up a wiring harness for no good reason whatsoever and as grandpa used to say this better be good.................. .
From : tbone
how hard is this to understand if one or more of the injectors is still getting its ground even with the engine not running then it would indicate a problem with the computer or the harness itself. is this really that hard to understand or are you guys just being assholes with some desperate need to say im wrong about something. -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving running and depending on the way they are switched one had better be missing at each one or he has a problem with the computer or harness. was this clear enough for you now okay... real slow this time... with the engine not running or more precisely with the crank sensor not providing a signal the asd relay remains open which doesnt provide any power to the + side of the injectors. so... no crank no voltage. since the injectors are always fed with voltage when the asd relay switches the pcm switches the ground to each injector in sequence when it wants to inject fuel. this means that the - side of the injectors are normally open to ground until switched by the ecm. again no crank no ground switch no reading. now - given that... can you explain how you would test for a bad injector with the engine not running using a simple multi-meter could this be why most professionals will use a noid light set to properly test fuel injectors rather than hacking up a wiring harness for no good reason whatsoever .
From : denny
really moron please tell me exactly where it is placed on my 97 ram. -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving tom a combination fuel filter and fuel pressure regulator is pressed into a rubber grommet located on the top of the fuel pump module inside the fuel tank. is that exact enough do i need to describe where the fuel tank is located also denny .
From : tbone
as usual you dont bother to read before responding. sometimes you are worse than budd. i asked for the vacuum controlled regulator that he claims all fuel injected engines have. -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving really moron please tell me exactly where it is placed on my 97 ram. -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving tom a combination fuel filter and fuel pressure regulator is pressed into a rubber grommet located on the top of the fuel pump module inside the fuel tank. is that exact enough do i need to describe where the fuel tank is located also denny .
From : denny
do you have any valid input not without guessing. he answered his own question when he thought he should check for codes. no then stfu. look who is giving advise he should be listening to. with a fuel pressure gauge he can test for both a bad fuel regulator and / or a hung injector. as soon as he turns the ignition on with the gauge connected to the rail he will know if the pump is over or under pressurizing the system. if the gauge drops right back to zero when he turns the ignition off then he either has a defective injector or check valve. if it was also under pressurized it is a clear indication of a leak in the injectors when combined with his other symptoms. not really clear. how about a pump that is not putting out with the ignition on and the car not running with a meter he can check for both voltage and ground at each injector and depending on the way they are switched he had better be missing one of them at each one or he has a problem with the computer or harness. this is not rocket science here i re-read this again. you are correct it is not rocket science. with the ign on and engine not running your conditions you can check all day for your voltage at the injectors and there will be none. the pcm has to have a crank signal from the dist to energize the asd to put voltage to the pump tps injectors and something else that im not recalling at this time. your rocket just crashed. sorry thats exactly what i meant denny. why dont you take the time to read it and pay attention instead of your desperate need to say im wrong. i have read it. i have re-read it. i have no desperate need to say youre wrong cause you are completely wrong on this and wont admit it. what you have not comprehended is that what you want to check is not possible with the key on and the engine not running. under these conditions there is no voltage to the injector. with no crank signal to the pcm the asd relay is open. there i said it again. do you comprehend this time i said to check to make sure an injector is not electrically held open to check them all for voltage and ground with the ignition on and the engine not running and depending on the way they are switched one had better be missing at each one or he has a problem with the computer or harness. was this clear enough for you now you are confusing yourself tom. you are trying so hard to prove yourself right that its getting funny. how are you going to check to makes sure and injector is not electrically held open if it has no voltage to it to check. it also has no ground thru the pcm under these conditions. so you check it it has no voltage and no continuity to ground at the injector connector. are you going to find a problem with the computer or harness or are you going to take another guess arent these capital letters really annoyingknowledgable people would test it with the key in the crank position using a noid light. under your test conditions you are testing nothing. you are going to find nothing. is this clear enough for you now your words not mine denny .
From : tom lawrence
how hard is this to understand if one or more of the injectors is still getting its ground even with the engine not running then it would okay - technically if someone drove a screw through the harness and managed to ground one of the injector driver circuits yes youd pick that up with your multimeter. however that 1-in-a-million chance aside the pcm uses solid-state switching so the chance of it being stuck is about half that of the screw-through-the-harness odds. now... all this silliness aside... its much more likely that if fuel is leaking from an injector then the injector is fouled mechanically and not allowing the pintle to seal against the seat properly allowing fuel to dribble out all the time. this is easily checked by removing the fuel rail with injectors attached tieing the rail up from the hood and turning the ignition to on. this will pressurize the system and if fuel is leaking well... theres your problem. of course this is done after a preliminary diagnosis is performed such as pulling any trouble codes looking at the plugs is one misfiring and observing map tps and iat values via obd-ii during engine operation to make sure theyre putting out acceptable values. and to answer your other question - no its not about being an asshole. its about giving the correct advice to troubleshoot a problem after understanding how the system works that youre giving advice on. when you have two professional automotive mechanics i dont count tell you that youre wrong and you dont want to listen well... then maybe the problem doesnt lie with them. .
From : budd cochran
i do know of budds knowledge with small engines and he does know how to get some serious power out of them. i give him credit for being a good common sense mechanic. denny thank you sir. youre quarter is in the mail. vbg budd .
From : jeepnutz
i think youve gotten some good advice here.. but if youre tired of reading all the infighting come over to rec.autos.maker.jeep+willys. there are a lot of brains over there who probably have been thru this.. and will be glad to help without attacking each other.. friend of mine is broke and ive offered yeah yeah im a sucker to help him fix his transportation - a 97 jeep wrangler 2.2l/5 speed. it has about 80k miles and recently had been down for a few months due to a spontanious transmission failure... essentially heres the conditions #1 - runs like shit an gets horrible fuel economy #2 - visable black no white or grey smoke from tailpipe at lower rpms/idle #3 - idles badly likes to die #4 - getting gas in oil.. personally this sounds exactly like when the fuel pressure regulator started leaking on my old exploder but weve come to realize its built like my 99 dodge and has no engine mounted vacuum adjusting fpr... my only ideas are either bad injectors computer gone haywire or sensor feeding it some bs or a bad in-tank fuel pressure regulator pushing the fuel rail pressure up. it is throwing a check engine light and that computer will dump out codes but i forgot to ask if he had checked them yet... any ideas thanks jacob suter .
From : transurgeon
in the return line at the fuel tank really moron please tell me exactly where it is placed on my 97 ram. -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving perhaps you didnt see the part where he said it doesnt have one!!!!! oh it has one spin-boi...............every fi system has one -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving friend of mine is broke and ive offered yeah yeah im a sucker to help him fix his transportation - a 97 jeep wrangler 2.2l/5 speed. it has about 80k miles and recently had been down for a few months due to a spontanious transmission failure... essentially heres the conditions #1 - runs like shit an gets horrible fuel economy #2 - visable black no white or grey smoke from tailpipe at lower rpms/idle #3 - idles badly likes to die #4 - getting gas in oil.. personally this sounds exactly like when the fuel pressure regulator started leaking on my old exploder but weve come to realize its built like my 99 dodge and has no engine mounted vacuum adjusting fpr... my only ideas are either bad injectors computer gone haywire or sensor feeding it some bs or a bad in-tank fuel pressure regulator pushing the fuel rail pressure up. it is throwing a check engine light and that computer will dump out codes but i forgot to ask if he had checked them yet... any ideas you need to beg borrow or steal a fuel pressure guage to test this properly. it might be a good idea to gt those codes as well. i would lean more towards a hung or damaged injectors than a bad regulator although it is possible that a bad regulator damaged the injectors. a volt meter may also come in handy to make sure that none of the injectors are being held open electrically. tom i tried sitting on my fingers but its not working. you havent done any real-world drivability problems have you. you read this stuff and then think up possibilities while slurping down a cup of coffee sitting at a tabledont ya... if tom had a fucking clue he would suggest pulling the hose from fpr to intake and looking for liquid fuel............... denny .
From : transurgeon
nope never said that all engines have a vacuum controlled regulator just that all fi systems have a regulator as usual you dont bother to read before responding. sometimes you are worse than budd. i asked for the vacuum controlled regulator that he claims all fuel injected engines have. -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving really moron please tell me exactly where it is placed on my 97 ram. -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving tom a combination fuel filter and fuel pressure regulator is pressed into a rubber grommet located on the top of the fuel pump module inside the fuel tank. is that exact enough do i need to describe where the fuel tank is located also denny .
From : transurgeon
i think youve gotten some good advice here.. but if youre tired of reading all the infighting come over to rec.autos.maker.jeep+willys. its not infighting its more of whack our pinata known as t-boner and watch him spin there are a lot of brains over there who probably have been thru this.. and will be glad to help without attacking each other.. friend of mine is broke and ive offered yeah yeah im a sucker to help him fix his transportation - a 97 jeep wrangler 2.2l/5 speed. it has about 80k miles and recently had been down for a few months due to a spontanious transmission failure... essentially heres the conditions #1 - runs like shit an gets horrible fuel economy #2 - visable black no white or grey smoke from tailpipe at lower rpms/idle #3 - idles badly likes to die #4 - getting gas in oil.. personally this sounds exactly like when the fuel pressure regulator started leaking on my old exploder but weve come to realize its built like my 99 dodge and has no engine mounted vacuum adjusting fpr... my only ideas are either bad injectors computer gone haywire or sensor feeding it some bs or a bad in-tank fuel pressure regulator pushing the fuel rail pressure up. it is throwing a check engine light and that computer will dump out codes but i forgot to ask if he had checked them yet... any ideas thanks jacob suter .
From : tbone
yawn yet another lie. you made the claim that the problem is possibly due to a ruptured diaphragm in its vacuum controlled regulator even though he clearly posted that it didnt have that type and made some comment to denny to the tune of if tom had a fucking clue he would suggest pulling the hose from fpr to intake and looking for liquid fuel............... when i replied that he said that it didnt have one a vacuum controlled one your thoughtless reply was that they all have them. while they all have regulators they do not all have vacuum controlled ones so either way you were still wrong shade tree. next time read the phucking post completely before making your asinine comments. -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving nope never said that all engines have a vacuum controlled regulator just that all fi systems have a regulator as usual you dont bother to read before responding. sometimes you are worse than budd. i asked for the vacuum controlled regulator that he claims all fuel injected engines have. -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving really moron please tell me exactly where it is placed on my 97 ram. -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving tom a combination fuel filter and fuel pressure regulator is pressed into a rubber grommet located on the top of the fuel pump module inside the fuel tank. is that exact enough do i need to describe where the fuel tank is located also denny .
From : tbone
thank you for clearly making my point.and golly gee look at the two idiots that responded to you and what they said. gee tom l. its all me isnt it. -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving i think youve gotten some good advice here.. but if youre tired of reading all the infighting come over to rec.autos.maker.jeep+willys. there are a lot of brains over there who probably have been thru this.. and will be glad to help without attacking each other.. friend of mine is broke and ive offered yeah yeah im a sucker to help him fix his transportation - a 97 jeep wrangler 2.2l/5 speed. it has about 80k miles and recently had been down for a few months due to a spontanious transmission failure... essentially heres the conditions #1 - runs like shit an gets horrible fuel economy #2 - visable black no white or grey smoke from tailpipe at lower rpms/idle #3 - idles badly likes to die #4 - getting gas in oil.. personally this sounds exactly like when the fuel pressure regulator started leaking on my old exploder but weve come to realize its built like my 99 dodge and has no engine mounted vacuum adjusting fpr... my only ideas are either bad injectors computer gone haywire or sensor feeding it some bs or a bad in-tank fuel pressure regulator pushing the fuel rail pressure up. it is throwing a check engine light and that computer will dump out codes but i forgot to ask if he had checked them yet... any ideas thanks jacob suter .
From : tbone
do you have any valid input not without guessing. he answered his own question when he thought he should check for codes. perhaps you missed the part where he asked for suggestions. maybe im pointing out that correct suggestion may be of more help that wild ass guesses. lol there is no wild assed guess about getting the codes which i did say and hooking up a fuel pressure guage to see what is happening. he asked for suggestions and i gave him some nothing more. perhaps next time you might want to actually be helpfull rather than attacking for no valid reason. no then stfu. look who is giving advise he should be listening to. thats right its advice and ideas nothing more. with a fuel pressure gauge he can test for both a bad fuel regulator and / or a hung injector. as soon as he turns the ignition on with the gauge connected to the rail he will know if the pump is over or under pressurizing the system. if the gauge drops right back to zero when he turns the ignition off then he either has a defective injector or check valve. if it was also under pressurized it is a clear indication of a leak in the injectors when combined with his other symptoms. not really clear. how about a pump that is not putting out the fuel pressure gauge would indicate that with an under pressure reading wouldnt it that is correct. but it not mean it would be a leaky injector. low pressure could mean a pump regulator plugged filter restricted/kinked fuel line or injector. if an injector was leaking that bad you should be able to see it on the plug. yawn unless the check valve was also bad a leaking injectors would cause the pressure to fall back to zero when the engine was shut off much more quickly then it normally would. either way since the regulator and pump are combined if either were the problem he would still need to remove them as an assembly and replace them as such. on this particulat vehical the pump and filter assembly is separate from the pump. the p/f assembly is located on top of the fuel tank and the pump is a separate piece inside the tank. how could the pump be seperate from the pump and filter that is saying that the pump is seperate from the pump. btw are you saying that low pressure would cause these symptoms and if so please explain. nope that is not what i was saying. jacob was describing a rich condition which could be caused by a number of things. this is why it is important to pull any codes before guessing. possible problems in no particular order could be an oxygen sensor map sensor too high fuel pressure vacuum leak at the intakeor maybe even a restricted exhaust. i completely agree and also suggested pulling the codes. my suggestion was to diagnose his ideas of what was wrong. with the ignition on and the car not running with a meter he can check for both voltage and ground at each injector and depending on the way they are switched he had better be missing one of them at each one or he has a problem with the computer or harness. this is not rocket science here and it could be something completely different like the tps but the amount of fuel being dumped into the engine indicates some type of fuel delivery failure. btw i have a fuel injected nissan that i have owned and worked on for almost 12 years as well as the ram. it sounds like you have read a book somewhere. i read lots of books and work on vehicles as well but ill take that as a compliment just the same. no problem. not a thing wrong with reading and learning. to bad all your diagnosing doesnt really describe jacobs problem. a single injector will act more like a dead miss in the real world. not alot of chance that all would go bad at the same time. all that he said was that it was running like shit and blowing smoke. he was not specific about whether it was missing or not. he did say it wanted to stall at idle so that could be a miss or maybe not. as for them all going bad at the same time it could happen if the filter failed since it and the regulator are in the same housing and fouled them all. its a remote possibility but still a possibility at that. there are other things to look at first that are more likely to be the problem than an injector. he suggested bad injectors or over pressure. i simply gave him a suggestion on how to confirm or eliminate those as the cause of the problem. how many fuel injected vehicles do you work on ok you have worked on two. i do it for a living every day. thank you. doing what to them fixing them. i guess youll just have to take my word that ive made my living for the last 31 years fixing equipment that other people have broken. i work on what is on the order other than auto trans. those i havent been into for 14 years. i have no reason not to take your word. now what reason do you have to
From : tbone
perhaps you didnt see the part where he said it doesnt have one!!!!! -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving friend of mine is broke and ive offered yeah yeah im a sucker to help him fix his transportation - a 97 jeep wrangler 2.2l/5 speed. it has about 80k miles and recently had been down for a few months due to a spontanious transmission failure... essentially heres the conditions #1 - runs like shit an gets horrible fuel economy #2 - visable black no white or grey smoke from tailpipe at lower rpms/idle #3 - idles badly likes to die #4 - getting gas in oil.. personally this sounds exactly like when the fuel pressure regulator started leaking on my old exploder but weve come to realize its built like my 99 dodge and has no engine mounted vacuum adjusting fpr... my only ideas are either bad injectors computer gone haywire or sensor feeding it some bs or a bad in-tank fuel pressure regulator pushing the fuel rail pressure up. it is throwing a check engine light and that computer will dump out codes but i forgot to ask if he had checked them yet... any ideas you need to beg borrow or steal a fuel pressure guage to test this properly. it might be a good idea to gt those codes as well. i would lean more towards a hung or damaged injectors than a bad regulator although it is possible that a bad regulator damaged the injectors. a volt meter may also come in handy to make sure that none of the injectors are being held open electrically. tom i tried sitting on my fingers but its not working. you havent done any real-world drivability problems have you. you read this stuff and then think up possibilities while slurping down a cup of coffee sitting at a tabledont ya... if tom had a fucking clue he would suggest pulling the hose from fpr to intake and looking for liquid fuel............... denny .
From : budd cochran
is it really infighting or just damage control t-bone argues with everyone that has more mechanical knowledge than he does .. . . which is darn near everyone at one time or another. bg budd i think youve gotten some good advice here.. but if youre tired of reading all the infighting come over to rec.autos.maker.jeep+willys. there are a lot of brains over there who probably have been thru this.. and will be glad to help without attacking each other.. friend of mine is broke and ive offered yeah yeah im a sucker to help him fix his transportation - a 97 jeep wrangler 2.2l/5 speed. it has about 80k miles and recently had been down for a few months due to a spontanious transmission failure... essentially heres the conditions #1 - runs like shit an gets horrible fuel economy #2 - visable black no white or grey smoke from tailpipe at lower rpms/idle #3 - idles badly likes to die #4 - getting gas in oil.. personally this sounds exactly like when the fuel pressure regulator started leaking on my old exploder but weve come to realize its built like my 99 dodge and has no engine mounted vacuum adjusting fpr... my only ideas are either bad injectors computer gone haywire or sensor feeding it some bs or a bad in-tank fuel pressure regulator pushing the fuel rail pressure up. it is throwing a check engine light and that computer will dump out codes but i forgot to ask if he had checked them yet... any ideas thanks jacob suter .
From : tbone
wrong again braniac he never said what kind it had only that he couldnt find it try again spin-boi really this is what he said. personally this sounds exactly like when the fuel pressure regulator started leaking on my old exploder but weve come to realize its built like my 99 dodge and has no engine mounted vacuum adjusting fpr... sounds to me like he knew what type it had. to bad you either didnt read it or were unable to understand what was written. care to try again sounds to me like he just dont know and is too lazy to look for it no it just sounds like you once again got caught with your pants down. you are really beginning to make a real habit out of this. -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving .
From : budd cochran
not that i can see except maybe just in you distorted little ego tommy-troll-boy. budd yes he did. he supported the point that i made to denny and tom l. about how this childish infighting and attacks which are usually started by you and shade tree are causing people to go elsewhere to both get and give information. are you proud of your accomplishments -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving uh tommy-troll-boy he didnt agree with you he didnt support you position at all so he couldnt support your point. budd thank you for clearly making my point.and golly gee look at the two idiots that responded to you and what they said. gee tom l. its all me isnt it. -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving i think youve gotten some good advice here.. but if youre tired of reading all the infighting come over to rec.autos.maker.jeep+willys. there are a lot of brains over there who probably have been thru this.. and will be glad to help without attacking each other.. friend of mine is broke and ive offered yeah yeah im a sucker to help him fix his transportation - a 97 jeep wrangler 2.2l/5 speed. it has about 80k miles and recently had been down for a few months due to a spontanious transmission failure... essentially heres the conditions #1 - runs like shit an gets horrible fuel economy #2 - visable black no white or grey smoke from tailpipe at lower rpms/idle #3 - idles badly likes to die #4 - getting gas in oil.. personally this sounds exactly like when the fuel pressure regulator started leaking on my old exploder but weve come to realize its built like my 99 dodge and has no engine mounted vacuum adjusting fpr... my only ideas are either bad injectors computer gone haywire or sensor feeding it some bs or a bad in-tank fuel pressure regulator pushing the fuel rail pressure up. it is throwing a check engine light and that computer will dump out codes but i forgot to ask if he had checked them yet... any ideas thanks jacob suter .
From : jeepnutz
wayne wrote the throttle position sensor. -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving did you check the tps what is tps i am taking it to a different dealer tomorrow to see if they can fix problem will post results on friday. hi didnt get truck back until late friday. this time they replaced the intake gasket and intake manifold gaskets!!!! cost lots of money 770.00 but they said that this would fix my problem. guess what problem is still there as bad as ever. i am fit to be tied dont know what my next move should be or will be. i think i am getting stroked by these dealers. any suggestions im afraid if i take it in again that they may paint it as it does have stone chips. hahah would be funny if it didnt cost so much. any advice would be appreciated. where the heck you at sounds like the dealers around here. im still leaning towards fuel pressure regulator. may have to lift the box to see if its a replaceable part of the fuel pump or not. haynes says it is. parts dealers say it might be but none of them are listing it as a replaceable part though. this dealer says they just replace the whole fuel pump. will let me know tues. if their parts manuals show it. how could a damned fuel pump be so mysterious i cant believe no one knows anything about them and is haynes wrong and because of the intermittent rough idle and idle stumble i was also told to check for a bad injector that may be stuck . i think ill check them first. .
From : tbone
lol wrong again. there is no fuel return line on my truck. besides the fuel line there is a evap hose which has nothing to do with fuel regulation. care to try again -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving in the return line at the fuel tank really moron please tell me exactly where it is placed on my 97 ram. -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving perhaps you didnt see the part where he said it doesnt have one!!!!! oh it has one spin-boi...............every fi system has one -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving friend of mine is broke and ive offered yeah yeah im a sucker to help him fix his transportation - a 97 jeep wrangler 2.2l/5 speed. it has about 80k miles and recently had been down for a few months due to a spontanious transmission failure... essentially heres the conditions #1 - runs like shit an gets horrible fuel economy #2 - visable black no white or grey smoke from tailpipe at lower rpms/idle #3 - idles badly likes to die #4 - getting gas in oil.. personally this sounds exactly like when the fuel pressure regulator started leaking on my old exploder but weve come to realize its built like my 99 dodge and has no engine mounted vacuum adjusting fpr... my only ideas are either bad injectors computer gone haywire or sensor feeding it some bs or a bad in-tank fuel pressure regulator pushing the fuel rail pressure up. it is throwing a check engine light and that computer will dump out codes but i forgot to ask if he had checked them yet... any ideas you need to beg borrow or steal a fuel pressure guage to test this properly. it might be a good idea to gt those codes as well. i would lean more towards a hung or damaged injectors than a bad regulator although it is possible that a bad regulator damaged the injectors. a volt meter may also come in handy to make sure that none of the injectors are being held open electrically. tom i tried sitting on my fingers but its not working. you havent done any real-world drivability problems have you. you read this stuff and then think up possibilities while slurping down a cup of coffee sitting at a tabledont ya... if tom had a fucking clue he would suggest pulling the hose from fpr to intake and looking for liquid fuel............... denny .
From : transurgeon
ive put over half a million miles on dodge engines changing the oil every 6k miles and have never had an engine problem. check the maintenance schedule in your owners manual it say 7500 miles. jam . 222 288909 ir%zc.109964$fg5.10935@attbis53 wrong again braniac he never said what kind it had only that he couldnt find it try again spin-boi yawn yet another lie. you made the claim that the problem is possibly due to a ruptured diaphragm in its vacuum controlled regulator even though he clearly posted that it didnt have that type and made some comment to denny to the tune of if tom had a fucking clue he would suggest pulling the hose from fpr to intake and looking for liquid fuel............... when i replied that he said that it didnt have one a vacuum controlled one your thoughtless reply was that they all have them. while they all have regulators they do not all have vacuum controlled ones so either way you were still wrong shade tree. next time read the phucking post completely before making your asinine comments. -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving nope never said that all engines have a vacuum controlled regulator just that all fi systems have a regulator as usual you dont bother to read before responding. sometimes you are worse than budd. i asked for the vacuum controlled regulator that he claims all fuel injected engines have. -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving really moron please tell me exactly where it is placed on my 97 ram. -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving tom a combination fuel filter and fuel pressure regulator is pressed into a rubber grommet located on the top of the fuel pump module inside the fuel tank. is that exact enough do i need to describe where the fuel tank is located also denny .
From : tbone
wrong again braniac he never said what kind it had only that he couldnt find it try again spin-boi really this is what he said. personally this sounds exactly like when the fuel pressure regulator started leaking on my old exploder but weve come to realize its built like my 99 dodge and has no engine mounted vacuum adjusting fpr... sounds to me like he knew what type it had. to bad you either didnt read it or were unable to understand what was written. care to try again -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving .
From : budd cochran
lol i never said that budd has not contributed or doesnt know anything that would be him saying that to me. by his own admission he has been dealing with trolls since his second day which translates into starting shit with newbies as i doubt there were many trolls back in the beginning. after over 8 years he had better contributed more than i did in about 3. the one big difference here is that budd can say whatever he wants and right or wrong at most all he will get is corrected. if i or anyone else that is not part of the core group says anything that is not dead solid perfect with absolutely no way to misinterpret it they hear a lot of shit and most of it coming consistently from certain people and i will not make accusations as to who. i dont know which is worse; your spin on the facts or the exaggeration of untruths. how can an untruth be exaggerated i didnt know they could be until you came along. it is either true or it isnt. agreed though you often dispute truths with unproven theory. i think that you know that what much of what i say is true although sometimes exaggerated. i think much of what you say is corrupted and deliberately accusatory for the continuance of arguments. the difference tom is simple. if im corrected by someone with knowledge i recognize as superior to mine i accept and learn from it. otoh you will cuss fight whine spin lie and anything else you can when corrected. and i am no different. really the problem is that with the exception of the core group you think of yourself as superior to all commers and if someone disagrees with you you attack them. in my 8 years here you have been the one to recieve the majority of corrections which generally result in you replying with a vengance no matter how it is worded. what sets you off imho is that there is a core group and youre not part of it. btw in my own experience most groups have core groups of some kind though most groups wont admit to it. if someone corrects me and im wrong i accept that and learn from it. sorry tom but i can remeber many times that ive tried to approach you politely and calmly only to recieve some kind of attack; on my health mentality or just that i am accepted by the core group. the odd part is beekeeper and i dont get along well but in reality he is part of the core group. why would he be acceptable over you obviously i dont decide who is or isnt a member. when someone corrects me and i know that is not what i said or meant i try and explain myself. but when anyone asks for any shred of support to your position you treat them all alike you ignore the request or attack them personally. the problem is that people like you dont accept that and call it spin and attack and when that happens like you i dont back down. tom im sorry but i dont use spin tactics. ill use your own statements against you but re-worded to give an opportunity if you choose to explain you position better; ill use like in the political thread uncorrupted info from what should be an acceptable source against you or ill tease with non-vulgar words. its called respect. respect begets respect. when you start showing to others that you dont know it will come back to you and the same goes for me. and dissing begets dissing. many times tom and im confident others will back me up ive tried as have others just like the past few replies to offer a bit of respect to you. a little courtesy as well only to have you throw it back in my face. however youve taken the attitude that none of the regulars are worthy of a polite reply. then you expect to be respected maybe you should consider the possibility that youve shot the dove of peace and ate it for lunch. if a newbie poster spouts crap like you have then yeah theyll catch it. im usually the quickest because i havent for health reasons worked as many hours as have some others. so sue me. what does your health have to do with anything nothing except you keep trying to use as a weapon against me. why is that tom who made you the phucking net nanny of the group no one. i dont claim to be a net nanny. trust me if i were acting like one the one of the other regulars would have let me know but probably by email. just because you think that it is crap doesnt make it so. just because you think it isnt doesnt make it so. wouldnt you say that having a few more years experience with basic mechanical devices 10 years forklift mechanic 45 years off / on small engine / yard equipment mechanic 10 years journeyman millwright and 40 years working on automobiles for friends and family not to mention building a successful drag car could give a person a bit of an edge in recognizing the accuracy of some information over a person with admittedly much less experience. you neednt make any accusations youve made them so many times in the p
From : tbone
hi could someone please respond to my post in dodge truck. thanx .
From : tbone
need help with my 97 ram 1500. the high beams stay on and dont turn off even if the truck is off . had to remove my fuse to turn off the lights multi-function switch is jammed on. i assume you tried wiggling the stick around a bit... the switch will most likely need to be changed out. this is a minor pita to do because it involves removing the steering wheel which involves messing with the airbag. iirc you dont have to remove the steering wheel to replace the dimmer switch. it is a minor pita though since it requires a tamper-proof torx bit #20 i believe which most folks dont have. iirc you remove three screws holding the shroud on and then three screws holding the dimmer switch on. disconnect the plug at the harness. reverse procedure to install. disconnect battery first of course to prevent inadvertent airbag deployment. mike .
From : redneck tookover hell
welcome to my kill file douche bag -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving this time they replaced the intake gasket and intake manifold gaskets!!!! cost lots of money 770.00 but they said that this would fix my problem. guess what problem is still there as bad as ever sounds like t boner is the mechanic at that dealership politics the gentle art of getting votes from the poor and campaign funds from the rich. .
From : budd cochran
uh tommy-troll-boy he didnt agree with you he didnt support you position at all so he couldnt support your point. budd thank you for clearly making my point.and golly gee look at the two idiots that responded to you and what they said. gee tom l. its all me isnt it. -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving i think youve gotten some good advice here.. but if youre tired of reading all the infighting come over to rec.autos.maker.jeep+willys. there are a lot of brains over there who probably have been thru this.. and will be glad to help without attacking each other.. friend of mine is broke and ive offered yeah yeah im a sucker to help him fix his transportation - a 97 jeep wrangler 2.2l/5 speed. it has about 80k miles and recently had been down for a few months due to a spontanious transmission failure... essentially heres the conditions #1 - runs like shit an gets horrible fuel economy #2 - visable black no white or grey smoke from tailpipe at lower rpms/idle #3 - idles badly likes to die #4 - getting gas in oil.. personally this sounds exactly like when the fuel pressure regulator started leaking on my old exploder but weve come to realize its built like my 99 dodge and has no engine mounted vacuum adjusting fpr... my only ideas are either bad injectors computer gone haywire or sensor feeding it some bs or a bad in-tank fuel pressure regulator pushing the fuel rail pressure up. it is throwing a check engine light and that computer will dump out codes but i forgot to ask if he had checked them yet... any ideas thanks jacob suter .
From : budd cochran
the throttle position sensor. -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving did you check the tps what is tps i am taking it to a different dealer tomorrow to see if they can fix problem will post results on friday. hi didnt get truck back until late friday. this time they replaced the intake gasket and intake manifold gaskets!!!! cost lots of money 770.00 but they said that this would fix my problem. guess what problem is still there as bad as ever. i am fit to be tied dont know what my next move should be or will be. i think i am getting stroked by these dealers. any suggestions im afraid if i take it in again that they may paint it as it does have stone chips. hahah would be funny if it didnt cost so much. any advice would be appreciated. .
From : tbone
yes he did. he supported the point that i made to denny and tom l. about how this childish infighting and attacks which are usually started by you and shade tree are causing people to go elsewhere to both get and give information. are you proud of your accomplishments -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving uh tommy-troll-boy he didnt agree with you he didnt support you position at all so he couldnt support your point. budd thank you for clearly making my point.and golly gee look at the two idiots that responded to you and what they said. gee tom l. its all me isnt it. -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving i think youve gotten some good advice here.. but if youre tired of reading all the infighting come over to rec.autos.maker.jeep+willys. there are a lot of brains over there who probably have been thru this.. and will be glad to help without attacking each other.. friend of mine is broke and ive offered yeah yeah im a sucker to help him fix his transportation - a 97 jeep wrangler 2.2l/5 speed. it has about 80k miles and recently had been down for a few months due to a spontanious transmission failure... essentially heres the conditions #1 - runs like shit an gets horrible fuel economy #2 - visable black no white or grey smoke from tailpipe at lower rpms/idle #3 - idles badly likes to die #4 - getting gas in oil.. personally this sounds exactly like when the fuel pressure regulator started leaking on my old exploder but weve come to realize its built like my 99 dodge and has no engine mounted vacuum adjusting fpr... my only ideas are either bad injectors computer gone haywire or sensor feeding it some bs or a bad in-tank fuel pressure regulator pushing the fuel rail pressure up. it is throwing a check engine light and that computer will dump out codes but i forgot to ask if he had checked them yet... any ideas thanks jacob suter .
From : transurgeon
wrong again braniac he never said what kind it had only that he couldnt find it try again spin-boi really this is what he said. personally this sounds exactly like when the fuel pressure regulator started leaking on my old exploder but weve come to realize its built like my 99 dodge and has no engine mounted vacuum adjusting fpr... sounds to me like he knew what type it had. to bad you either didnt read it or were unable to understand what was written. care to try again sounds to me like he just dont know and is too lazy to look for it -- if at first you dont succeed youre not cut out for skydiving .
From : tbone
yup the thread seems to be about dead. discussing politics and religion are usually futile on this ng. but my idiot is still better than your idiot. gbmfg roy oh yeah well mines still breathing . . . . uh sorta with mechanical help and encouragement and regular beating. so there! lol budd .
From : jeepnutz
lol hey i never know when i might need a bigger boat anchor. vbg budd small block chevy lashed to the back as well. but i wouldnt want expose the chevy or the scooter to contamination. thanks for looking out for the chevy small block! gbfg roy budd .
From : redneck tookover hell
lol. yea like your unplugging the non existing vacuum line to look for gas was any better. at least what i said would diagnose a failed regulator or leaking injector. yours would do neither since that vehicle doesnt another cluster fuck by da boner showing everyone how his lard ass cant cash the checks his alligator mouth writes what you said was so fucking stupid and worthless you should be embarrassed cant even figure out how to knock the metal tabs out of the rear brake backing plates and now youre the mr wizard of troubleshooting efi systems better spin that lardass your mouth keeps digging you deeper and deeper .
From : budd cochran
test .
From : redneck tookover hell
groan. . . . budd on tue 07 sep 2004 124428 gmt budd cochran mr-d150@citlinkspam.net wrote hmm... sorta like you can lead a horticulture but you cant make her think... lol yeah that could be right. the sad part is its not impossible to turn a life around but it does require you to make a commitment to turn it around. budd on tue 07 sep 2004 032236 gmt budd cochran mr-d150@citlinkspam.net wrote i see . . . youre just anti-american. budd no just another idiot passing by. i think his life sucks pretty badly so he needs someone to blame. you really dont understand how the government of the usa works do you where are you from fuck the government. those who planned the 911 attacks were masterminds. mac .
From : transurgeon
yes he did. he supported the point that i made to denny and tom l. about how this childish infighting and attacks which are usually started by you and shade tree are causing people to go elsewhere to both get and give information. kinda like your sure-fire handy-dandy rootin-tootin cant-miss method of troubleshooting the injectors eh .