OT- Need help with a Briggs engine so the old Cushman can keep putt-putting along
From : budd cochran mrd150 preciscom spam net
Q: once again. go back read the posts. i never changed my test method. -- -chris 05 ctd 99 durango ohms law works just fine chris its your testing methods that seem to change once i point out the flaws. or is it just the description because you didnt actually describe it correctly whichever ill allow you two self proclaimed geniuses to your flawed logic and devices. -- max there are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty soap ballot jury and ammo. please use in that order. -ed howdershelt author christopher thompson wrote be a very effective method of checking the circuits. however it does not determine if the voltage drop under load is due to wiring or battery. yes it does max. if you have a load connected so the circuit is complete then measuring from the outer shell to neg post should result in 0 volts or nearly same with positive post to center post youll have to back probe as a load needs to be connected to complete the circuit. now using ohms law we know that if there is resistance in either of the pos or neg side of the circuit you will see a voltage drop meaning you will read a voltage acrost that resistance. if the voltage is 0 then that means the resistance is 0. christopher max and budd stop just short of saying that ohms law is false and it is clear that they do not understand its application. plus the fact that max thru dishonesty or ignorance plays shell games with the facts - for example - here you clearly say that to do the voltage drop thing you apply a load and in maxs post immediately following he says that you wont get a voltage drop because you didnt apply a load. bill putney to reply by e-mail replace the last letter of the alphabet in my address with the letter x yes i know thats why ive talked myself out of replying serveral times. ive followed the thread for the most part from the begining. -- -chris 05 ctd 99 durango .
Replies:
From : greg o
the used engine i bought and am using on my old cushman did not have a shroud with it so im missing a set of identifying numbers i need for getting a parts list from briggs. i need to replace the valves and get the valve clearance back to where it belongs. what i need are the model 6 digits and code 4 digits plus a 2 digit factory i.d. and the serial number off a 7 hp horizontal shaft engine tiller riding mower chipper that is a classic engine no quantum i/c or vanguard built after 1980. the numbers will look like this model code serial 170402 xxxx -0x 80xxxxxxx i appreciate the help folks. budd *** free account sponsored by secureix.com *** *** encrypt your internet usage with a free vpn account from http//www.secureix.com *** my bet on the valves are exhaust 390419 intake 299884. this exhaust valve uses the tapered keepers similar what is used on automobile engines. intake uses the simple keyhole style retainer. head gasket 270430 valve cover gasket 27803 intake to block gasket 27828 intake clearance .006 exhaust clearance 010 http//www.briggsandstratton.com/ipl/pdfs/100/ms5577.pdf greg .
From : budd cochran mrd150 preciscom spam net
thanks greg. i saved a copy of the pdf. when i bought the later model block i was needing to replace a 68 engine with a big sand hole in the bore that opened up during honing for a re-ring. if it had been lower no problem but the darn thing was in the upper 1/3 of the stroke. and i knew i should have passed it up for lack of a shroud but i didnt . . .. thanks again. -- budd cochran the used engine i bought and am using on my old cushman did not have a shroud with it so im missing a set of identifying numbers i need for getting a parts list from briggs. i need to replace the valves and get the valve clearance back to where it belongs. what i need are the model 6 digits and code 4 digits plus a 2 digit factory i.d. and the serial number off a 7 hp horizontal shaft engine tiller riding mower chipper that is a classic engine no quantum i/c or vanguard built after 1980. the numbers will look like this model code serial 170402 xxxx -0x 80xxxxxxx i appreciate the help folks. budd *** free account sponsored by secureix.com *** *** encrypt your internet usage with a free vpn account from http//www.secureix.com *** my bet on the valves are exhaust 390419 intake 299884. this exhaust valve uses the tapered keepers similar what is used on automobile engines. intake uses the simple keyhole style retainer. head gasket 270430 valve cover gasket 27803 intake to block gasket 27828 intake clearance .006 exhaust clearance 010 http//www.briggsandstratton.com/ipl/pdfs/100/ms5577.pdf greg *** free account sponsored by secureix.com *** *** encrypt your internet usage with a free vpn account from http//www.secureix.com *** .
From : mac davis
on mon 3 apr 2006 234333 -0500 greg o goo1959spam@cableone.net wrote the used engine i bought and am using on my old cushman did not have a shroud with it so im missing a set of identifying numbers i need for getting a parts list from briggs. i need to replace the valves and get the valve clearance back to where it belongs. what i need are the model 6 digits and code 4 digits plus a 2 digit factory i.d. and the serial number off a 7 hp horizontal shaft engine tiller riding mower chipper that is a classic engine no quantum i/c or vanguard built after 1980. the numbers will look like this model code serial 170402 xxxx -0x 80xxxxxxx i appreciate the help folks. budd *** free account sponsored by secureix.com *** *** encrypt your internet usage with a free vpn account from http//www.secureix.com *** my bet on the valves are exhaust 390419 intake 299884. this exhaust valve uses the tapered keepers similar what is used on automobile engines. intake uses the simple keyhole style retainer. head gasket 270430 valve cover gasket 27803 intake to block gasket 27828
From : clare at snyder on ca
exhaust clearance 010 http//www.briggsandstratton.com/ipl/pdfs/100/ms5577.pdf greg damn greg... im impressed! mac https//home.comcast.net/mac.davis https//home.comcast.net/mac.davis/woodstuff.htm . 222 315804 7kh5325dkcet89qpbflhl0qtko69m517vj@4ax.com on tue 04 apr 2006 114831 -0700 mac davis mac.davis@splinters.comcast.net wrote on mon 3 apr 2006 234333 -0500 greg o goo1959spam@cableone.net wrote the used engine i bought and am using on my old cushman did not have a shroud with it so im missing a set of identifying numbers i need for getting a parts list from briggs. i need to replace the valves and get the valve clearance back to where it belongs. what i need are the model 6 digits and code 4 digits plus a 2 digit factory i.d. and the serial number off a 7 hp horizontal shaft engine tiller riding mower chipper that is a classic engine no quantum i/c or vanguard built after 1980. the numbers will look like this model code serial 170402 xxxx -0x 80xxxxxxx i appreciate the help folks. budd what carb does it have what starter the model number and code are easy to determine/fake. the type will be a bit more problematic!! any idea what it came off of *** free account sponsored by secureix.com *** *** encrypt your internet usage with a free vpn account from http//www.secureix.com *** my bet on the valves are exhaust 390419 intake 299884. this exhaust valve uses the tapered keepers similar what is used on automobile engines. intake uses the simple keyhole style retainer. head gasket 270430 valve cover gasket 27803 intake to block gasket 27828 intake clearance .006 exhaust clearance 010 http//www.briggsandstratton.com/ipl/pdfs/100/ms5577.pdf greg damn greg... im impressed! mac https//home.comcast.net/mac.davis https//home.comcast.net/mac.davis/woodstuff.htm *** free account sponsored by secureix.com *** *** encrypt your internet usage with a free vpn account from http//www.secureix.com *** .
From : greg o
that much timing advance put it near 15-18 degrees btdc didnt it was that with the magnetron ignition points would have remained at stock timing because of the cut in the crank. no points magnetron. i had to build a mount for the coil to lower it to the flywheel. i really dont know for sure what the advance was but it sure ran good! you can buy off set flywheel keys but i figured i could wing it. i still have the engine but sold the cart a few years back. i tried to sell the engine with the cart but the buyer was looking for a two cycle engine and i just happened to have a reverse rotation west bend two cycle that would not work on anything except the cart so he bought it for a few dollars more and i held on the b&s. i think he screwed up! i ran that west bend on the cart for a while and the 5 hp b&s was a more powerful engine. greg .
From : budd cochran mrd150 preciscom spam net
greg set me a .pdf file of the complete parts list. but thanks for the help anyway. btw the original 1968 engine i had came off a senator tiller this one i have absolutely no idea what it came off of except it had the big flo-jet carb like my old engine. it now has a dual circuit alternator and 12v starter from 190000 series 8 hp vertical shaft. i love the parts interchangeability of briggs engines . . . thanks again to all. -- budd cochran on tue 04 apr 2006 114831 -0700 mac davis mac.davis@splinters.comcast.net wrote on mon 3 apr 2006 234333 -0500 greg o goo1959spam@cableone.net wrote the used engine i bought and am using on my old cushman did not have a shroud with it so im missing a set of identifying numbers i need for getting a parts list from briggs. i need to replace the valves and get the valve clearance back to where it belongs. what i need are the model 6 digits and code 4 digits plus a 2 digit factory i.d. and the serial number off a 7 hp horizontal shaft engine tiller riding mower chipper that is a classic engine no quantum i/c or vanguard built after 1980. the numbers will look like this model code serial 170402 xxxx -0x 80xxxxxxx i appreciate the help folks. budd what carb does it have what starter the model number and code are easy to determine/fake. the type will be a bit more problematic!! any idea what it came off of *** free account sponsored by secureix.com *** *** encrypt your internet usage with a free vpn account from http//www.secureix.com *** my bet on the valves are exhaust 390419 intake 299884. this exhaust valve uses the tapered keepers similar what is used on automobile engines. intake uses the simple keyhole style retainer. head gasket 270430 valve cover gasket 27803 intake to block gasket 27828 intake clearance .006 exhaust clearance 010 http//www.briggsandstratton.com/ipl/pdfs/100/ms5577.pdf greg damn greg... im impressed! mac https//home.comcast.net/mac.davis https//home.comcast.net/mac.davis/woodstuff.htm *** free account sponsored by secureix.com *** *** encrypt your internet usage with a free vpn account from http//www.secureix.com *** *** free account sponsored by secureix.com *** *** encrypt your internet usage with a free vpn account from http//www.secureix.com *** .
From : budd cochran mrd150 preciscom spam net
gregs another small engine mech in the group. i just couldnt get a parts list without the code number from briggs. -- budd cochran on mon 3 apr 2006 234333 -0500 greg o goo1959spam@cableone.net wrote the used engine i bought and am using on my old cushman did not have a shroud with it so im missing a set of identifying numbers i need for getting a parts list from briggs. i need to replace the valves and get the valve clearance back to where it belongs. what i need are the model 6 digits and code 4 digits plus a 2 digit factory i.d. and the serial number off a 7 hp horizontal shaft engine tiller riding mower chipper that is a classic engine no quantum i/c or vanguard built after 1980. the numbers will look like this model code serial 170402 xxxx -0x 80xxxxxxx i appreciate the help folks. budd *** free account sponsored by secureix.com *** *** encrypt your internet usage with a free vpn account from http//www.secureix.com *** my bet on the valves are exhaust 390419 intake 299884. this exhaust valve uses the tapered keepers similar what is used on automobile engines. intake uses the simple keyhole style retainer. head gasket 270430 valve cover gasket 27803 intake to block gasket 27828 intake clearance .006 exhaust clearance 010 http//www.briggsandstratton.com/ipl/pdfs/100/ms5577.pdf greg damn greg... im impressed! mac https//home.comcast.net/mac.davis https//home.comcast.net/mac.davis/woodstuff.htm *** free account sponsored by secureix.com *** *** encrypt your internet usage with a free vpn account from http//www.secureix.com *** .
From : greg o
greg . 222 315817 1236a0lip6ihl41@corp.super.com damn greg... im impressed! mac lol!! it has been 16 years since i locked the doors on the repair shop but somethings i still can dig out of the cobwebs! actually the older b&s engines like bud need information for had very few variations over the years. same block carb piston rod valves ............. well you get the idea! the only tough variations were crankshafts. there are many variations of the pto end of the crankshafts. some engines had over 100 different possibilities! the rest of the engine you could mix and match parts to your hearts content. greg .
From : greg o
greg set me a .pdf file of the complete parts list. but thanks for the help anyway. btw the original 1968 engine i had came off a senator tiller this one i have absolutely no idea what it came off of except it had the big flo-jet carb like my old engine. it now has a dual circuit alternator and 12v starter from 190000 series 8 hp vertical shaft. i love the parts interchangeability of briggs engines . . . thanks again to all. -- budd cochran yep! the 170400 and 190400 engines were virtually the same. iirc only the stroke was differant maybe it was the bore so the con rod & crank were differant between series. everything else would swap from one to the other. i remember more than once swapping parts to build one good engine from a 7 and 8 hp donor engines. greg .
From : greg o
thanks greg. i saved a copy of the pdf. when i bought the later model block i was needing to replace a 68 engine with a big sand hole in the bore that opened up during honing for a re-ring. if it had been lower no problem but the darn thing was in the upper 1/3 of the stroke. and i knew i should have passed it up for lack of a shroud but i didnt . . . thanks again. -- budd cochran no problem glad to see my 5 years of experience as owner of a small engine repair was not completely wasted!! i got a hold of an 8 hp b&s a few years ago that had a scored cylinder. i took it a part and found a casting flaw in the piston which caused the retainer to fall out and munch the cylinder wall. b&s warranted it no question even though it was well out of warranty! later on when i opened my shop i had a gent bring in a nos snowblower he bought from the implement company he worked for. the unit was about twenty years old but still in the box when he bought it! he ran it about 1/2 hour when the engine died. that engine had the same problem! i contacted b&s warranty department as it was an unusual situation no problem warranty starts when the unit is sold so it was covered! i had a pleasantly surprise
From : budd cochran mrd150 preciscom spam net
thanks greg. i saved a copy of the pdf. when i bought the later model block i was needing to replace a 68 engine with a big sand hole in the bore that opened up during honing for a re-ring. if it had been lower no problem but the darn thing was in the upper 1/3 of the stroke. and i knew i should have passed it up for lack of a shroud but i didnt . . . thanks again. -- budd cochran no problem glad to see my 5 years of experience as owner of a small engine repair was not completely wasted!! i got a hold of an 8 hp b&s a few years ago that had a scored cylinder. i took it a part and found a casting flaw in the piston which caused the retainer to fall out and munch the cylinder wall. b&s warranted it no question even though it was well out of warranty! later on when i opened my shop i had a gent bring in a nos snowblower he bought from the implement company he worked for. the unit was about twenty years old but still in the box when he bought it! he ran it about 1/2 hour when the engine died. that engine had the same problem! i contacted
From : budd cochran mrd150 preciscom spam net
warranty starts when the unit is sold so it was covered! i had a pleasantly surprised customer that day! greg while i was working for budgies small engines in co our number one warranty claim was simple self-destructed engines due to lack of lubrication. . . .the purchasers didnt fill the crankcase. second place went to engines overfilled . . . you can squeeze a quart and a half into a 92000 series if you tilt it ju-u-u-u-st right but it wont start easily. i remember back in 76 of a 190000 series on a snapper rider that came in for a tune up because it was down on power . . .twenty years after purchase. it still had the original points condenser and spark plug. sand or casting holes seem to be more common now than years ago because the new engine has 4 pinhead size holes in its bore and budgie fazzino said hed noticed an increase during the 15 years he was in the business. i just got a reply back from briggs and the answer was if you dont have the numbers forget getting a list. . . .actually it was a link to their site with that message on it saying politely that i needed the numbers. they really wouldnt want to know the modifications ive done that engine ... theyd probably say it cant be done. thanks again! budd *** free account sponsored by secureix.com *** *** encrypt your internet usage with a free vpn account from http//www.secureix.com *** . 222 315829 4433a6aa$0$28513$6d36acad@titian.nntpserver.com i was surprised at how much i could lighten the piston trimmed piston skirt and how much mass was in the cranks counter weighting. i made up a dummy weight equal to the rod big end plus half the weight of the small end plus piston & rings and then drilled the counter weights till it would stay in what ever position i placed it on a leveled set of parallels. pop the plug and pull this engine thru and it doesnt want to shake from imbalance but it will spin five or six turns nice and easy. when running it hardly vibrates and revs up much faster than ive ever seen before. -- budd cochran greg set me a .pdf file of the complete parts list. but thanks for the help anyway. btw the original 1968 engine i had came off a senator tiller this one i have absolutely no idea what it came off of except it had the big flo-jet carb like my old engine. it now has a dual circuit alternator and 12v starter from 190000 series 8 hp vertical shaft. i love the parts interchangeability of briggs engines . . . thanks again to all. -- budd cochran yep! the 170400 and 190400 engines were virtually the same. iirc only the stroke was differant maybe it was the bore so the con rod & crank were differant between series. everything else would swap from one to the other. i remember more than once swapping parts to build one good engine from a 7 and 8 hp donor engines. greg *** free account sponsored by secureix.com *** *** encrypt your internet usage with a free vpn account from http//www.secureix.com *** .
From : greg o
i was surprised at how much i could lighten the piston trimmed piston skirt and how much mass was in the cranks counter weighting. i made up a dummy weight equal to the rod big end plus half the weight of the small end plus piston & rings and then drilled the counter weights till it would stay in what ever position i placed it on a leveled set of parallels. pop the plug and pull this engine thru and it doesnt want to shake from imbalance but it will spin five or six turns nice and easy. when running it hardly vibrates and revs up much faster than ive ever seen before. -- budd cochran i have a 5 hp that i built up for a go-cart. stock parts for the most part. i polished the rod thinking it may hold together better used a 3 hp flywheel 1 inch smaller in diameter and a pound lighter. remounted the ignition coil to fit. advanced the flywheel abut 1/2 the thickness of the keyway and torque the flywheel down with no locating key removed the nut to be sure it stayed. set the governor at 6000 rpm instead of the measly 3600. milled the head a bunch! i measured the valves height from the top of the block and milled the head so the valve pocket in the head had the same depth then added a standard head gasket for the valve to head clearance. the only non-b&s parts were the tillotson carburetor and the intake manifold i made so the carb would mount inline with the intake port. kind of a baby tunnel ram! getting the governor linkage to work was tricky but i got it. i put that engine in a small racing frame i picked up. i just ran it as a play cart and it was fun! it would go from zero to 40 mph in 30-40 feet. you could feel the governor drop of when it hit max speed. i had extra sprockets for top end around 60 mph but i never did try it with them. no doubt in my mind it would have done it! with the ignition advance light flywheel and higher compression you had to hang on when starting it. it would kick back and the starting rope hard enough to do bodily damage! i would warn friends to really hang on when starting an the would just look at me like i was silly until they gave it a pull! i pulled tendons in my right hand pull starting it once! took a year to heal from it! -- poorub 05 ultra classic .
From : budd cochran mrd150 preciscom spam net
i was surprised at how much i could lighten the piston trimmed piston skirt and how much mass was in the cranks counter weighting. i made up a dummy weight equal to the rod big end plus half the weight of the small end plus piston & rings and then drilled the counter weights till it would stay in what ever position i placed it on a leveled set of parallels. pop the plug and pull this engine thru and it doesnt want to shake from imbalance but it will spin five or six turns nice and easy. when running it hardly vibrates and revs up much faster than ive ever seen before. -- budd cochran i have a 5 hp that i built up for a go-cart. stock parts for the most part. i polished the rod thinking it may hold together better used a 3 hp flywheel 1 inch smaller in diameter and a pound lighter. remounted the ignition coil to fit. advanced the flywheel abut 1/2 the thickness of the keyway and torque the flywheel down with no locating key removed the nut to be sure it stayed. set the governor at 6000 rpm instead of the measly 3600. milled the head a bunch! i measured the valves height from the top of the block and milled the head so the valve pocket in the head had the same depth then added a standard head gasket for the valve to head clearance. the only non-b&s parts were the tillotson carburetor and the intake manifold i made so the carb would mount inline with the intake port. kind of a baby tunnel ram! getting the governor linkage to work was tricky but i got it. that much timing advance put it near 15-18 degrees btdc didnt it was that with the magnetron ignition points would have remained at stock timing because of the cut in the crank. ive given some thought to adapting a auto distributor with mechanical advance to my engine but driving the distributor would be the hard part with the flywheel in the way on one end and the clutches / pulleys etc on the other. my first head milling was on a 3 1/2 hp engine that had a severely warped head. my step-dad had me sand it down with sandpaper on a plate of glass until it was flat. the only head gasket available was a 0.030 dead soft copper gasket hand cut by the local tinker shop. i weighed about 85 pounds at the time and i had to stand on top of the mower deck to hold it down for starting! but boy! would that thing mow grass weeds small trees. i put that engine in a small racing frame i picked up. i just ran it as a play cart and it was fun! it would go from zero to 40 mph in 30-40 feet. you could feel the governor drop of when it hit max speed. i had extra sprockets for top end around 60 mph but i never did try it with them. no doubt in my mind it would have done it! with the ignition advance light flywheel and higher compression you had to hang on when starting it. it would kick back and the starting rope hard enough to do bodily damage! i would warn friends to really hang on when starting an the would just look at me like i was silly until they gave it a pull! i pulled tendons in my right hand pull starting it once! took a year to heal from it! i wanted to use a mikuni cv carb on my engine but finding a 28 mm version is difficult. on the previous short block i ran the valve lash at 0.004 and 0.008 and since this engine needs valve work anyway im going to set these at the same specs. it wont help lift much but it adds considerable duration. budd *** free account sponsored by secureix.com *** *** encrypt your internet usage with a free vpn account from http//www.secureix.com *** .
From : greg o
west bend engines were often finicky but i never knew they were bigoted and would only work carts. bg lol! well the reverse rotation kinda limited it usefulness! greg .
From : budd cochran mrd150 preciscom spam net
that much timing advance put it near 15-18 degrees btdc didnt it was that with the magnetron ignition points would have remained at stock timing because of the cut in the crank. no points magnetron. i had to build a mount for the coil to lower it to the flywheel. i really dont know for sure what the advance was but it sure ran good! you can buy off set flywheel keys but i figured i could wing it. i still have the engine but sold the cart a few years back. i tried to sell the engine with the cart but the buyer was looking for a two cycle engine and i just happened to have a reverse rotation west bend two cycle that would not work on anything except the cart so he bought it for a few dollars more and i held on the b&s. i think he screwed up! i ran that west bend on the cart for a while and the 5 hp b&s was a more powerful engine. greg west bend engines were often finicky but i never knew they were bigoted and would only work carts. bg i think the best thing to happen to two-strokes is the reduction in fuel mix ratios. i put a older tecumseh 3.5 hp 2-stroke on a old 4 hp evinrude lower unit to build a boat motor once and the 241 mix ratio made it so darn smoky when sneaking into a good bass spot i soon went back to rowing. budd *** free account sponsored by secureix.com *** *** encrypt your internet usage with a free vpn account from http//www.secureix.com *** .
From : budd cochran mrd150 preciscom spam net
im not so sure about that. reversed rotation has advantages. one is there would be no need for a reverse gear in a transmission and youd have as many gears forward as reverse. most cushman singles for example rotate clockwise looking at the end of the output shaft while my briggs rotates counterclockwise looking at the shaft. that means the engine rotates opposite the oem and it creates a whole set of troubles of its own ... my transmission had to be one that i could input my power into the left side and still run the rear wheel in the right direction; ive got a 1 dia exhaust pipe 4 from a fuel tank under full bodywork; my carburetor is probably sucking engine heat i had to make a way to disconnect the centrifugal clutch from the trans so it can be shifted. now if only i could get briggs to build cushman friendly engines . . . -- budd cochran west bend engines were often finicky but i never knew they were bigoted and would only work carts. bg lol! well the reverse rotation kinda limited it usefulness! greg *** free account sponsored by secureix.com *** *** encrypt your internet usage with a free vpn account from http//www.secureix.com *** .